i bet that thing of google cutting security stuff for pixel11 was because the government complained about graphene making it unhackable

It's probable and now they aren't even hiding themselves anymore.

Shaming Google will only work for so long. Grapheme is is doomed to fail as long as it has a complete dependence on Google's whims.

Have they announced the pivot to a non-android platform? Being security-mind it is frankly bizarre they have long ignored the Google dependency as a huge risk for the project.

Idk if i am missing someting, but what Plattform other than Android is suitable? Linux is just not there yet and people want a phone they can use easily, which graphene is and Linux is just not there yet i think

That's exactly my point, there's none and GrapheneOS are not working to create a suitable one yet.

The time to start working on plan B is yesterday

They don't particularly like Linux as a platform from a security standpoint:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49594106

Maybe they need to look at haiku. :-p

I feel vindicated for pivoting to Ubuntu Touch. It's far from secure and is admittedly inferior to Android right now, but at least it has no dependence on Google. I kind of saw this coming the second they annouced closing down Android and making security fixes no longer open source

Graphene's problem is that its very high firmware and other requirements mean they have to stand on the shoulders of giants. Their problem is that the giant is Google.

They would probably need huge resources to do that on their own, which is why they have to rely on the maintenance effort of some large company.

It’s interesting to hear it has high hardware requirements. I didn’t know that. That sounds similar to the problem that also causes planned obsolescence in phones generally.

But somehow Android, which is based on Linux, somehow checks those points for them...

The hipocrisy is too big to ignore and it's true, with that mindset of just wanting and waiting for someone else to do the hard work for them to just add patches here and there... they're doomed to fail.

High requirements not as in performance but hardware security feature. But that is the easy part as far as I understand. The difficult part is the requirement of super fast and constant security patching.

Ah, I see.

Likely plan B is fork AOSP and crossport security fixes, such features as Google deigns to put in AOSP and so forth. They can do that at any time they choose, may as well wring as much work out of the big G as possible, later is better. Remember their focus is security, it just happens to benefit privacy as well.

Here's hoping they can hang on long enough that there's a viable hardened Linux phone to take the role.

they have long ignored the Google dependency

What a silly thing to say.

I'm absolutely certain that no contributors, and extraordinarily few users, are ignoring the risks implied by the google dependency.

A pixel with Graphene is the best option for a daily driver for as long as it's viable. I expect that's everyone's understanding of the project.

I don't really see how this project can "pivot to a non-android platform", as I imagine none of their codebase can be transferred.

Sooner or later the project will become non-viable and we will all switch to whatever the best option is at that time.

ive seen the same news on reddit and lemmy. reddit was like "omg gimme that feature, even i dont use it, it is my right". lemmy is like "are you insane? just get a better platform, your dependency from google is going to kill you"

I will never understand this argument. Why in gods name would it be better for them to switch to a completely different OS like Linux and essentially have to destroy the entire ecosystem and start from scratch vs just hard forking current AOSP and maintaining it themselves?

But of course they would that. And it shouldn't take too long until Google makes Android completely proprietary.

They announced a partnership with Motorola and said it will makes things better for them.

i mean, i think there would be a lot of merit in maintaining a minimal linux platform that's basically just an android VM, that way it's basically infinitely easier to port to new devices and sandboxing becomes quite ironclad.

Supposedly. Yet Motorola doesn't have the reputation to be frantical about their firmware and security updating. Also, they are not at the source either, Google is. That also adds delay. We will see how the partnership with Motorola will work out in practice.

Sooner or later the project will become non-viable and we will all switch to whatever the best option is at that time.

Or everybody who isn't Google will have to collaborate on a hard fork of AOSP.

Or some governments will have to finally break out of their oligarchic regulatory capture and step in with antitrust law.

AOSP is the most secure base. GrapheneOS focus is to be the most secure OS. Not to be the best open source mobile OS or even to be FLOSS.

Notice how they're complaining only about things that could improve security, not general usablity fixes.

I don't think you understand how different Android and Linux distributions truly are.

Linux alone refers to the kernel. There are custom AOSP kernels based on the Linux LTS versions with a few extra patches but that is basically all that connects Linux to Android.

But absolutely everything in userland is wholly diifferent in Android than with any Linux distribution out there.

And you can't just replicate what Android did on top of the Linux kernel without Google amounts of resources. Which GrapheneOS does not have in the slightest.

I don’t think you understand how different Android and Linux distributions truly are.

But they're both things that drive on the same road, using wheels and engines and steering wheels and seats and doors!

Yes, and one is a car and one is a semi truck. (I'm not saying either is close to those things, the point is how different Android and Linux are)

How the fuck will words
Make any real difference
This is joke - please clap

Can't wait for the android with a forked bsd kernel that self destructs if you install Firefox

I really like reading some stuff like that from a website that summarises a few mastodon posts and additionally adds 10 ads and trackers.

How about posting the original source next time?

I feel like this sort of friction is inevitable. Ideally we'd just move on from Android one day, but that's asking a lot. Not completely, but something that can still support Android apps.

"frantical"?

Comedy is hard

Sometimes a joke just won't work

Clap clap clap clap cap

cap

wait, is that a threat? Are you threatening to cap my ass?

:)

Typing, too, is hard

Not a threat, but a fuckup

Haha, no cap fam

A boycott-divest-sanction kernel? Hell yeah!

I agree, but to be fair, the current way involves completely obscured binary blobs for nearly every part of the hardware. Which is the main lock-in to be had on Android devices.

Even the pixel under GOS is using the proprietary device tree. There's no getting away from that unless you can RE the hardware and write your own drivers, which is impossibly hard for anything relatively current.

Is that a cromulent word?

Maybe, frantic or fanatical.

Grateful for this graphene os team.
They are doing a great job.

Alienating google is not really a problem in my view, google is already alien and hostile to everyone so it changes nothing.

Why? Are gonna write article?

Yeah but I think that's just changed with ai.

God I hate google so much

Me no write article. Will read original post that has like 5 sentence.

ear noise good

him no big brain why use many ideas and words?

But you see my friend - most these stupid communities don't let you just post random URLs. If people don't understand what they are seeing they accuse you if being a bot. Article is fine IMO, phoronix I thought exclusively cover Linux and shit

android with a forked bsd kernel

That sounds fantastic actually, where do I sign up?

While my dream is to see something like PostMarketOS replace java junk Android someday, my immediate desire is to see Motorola kick Google's ass with GrapheneOS.

Oniro OS is pretty secure.

OniroOS could be a good base.

I don't understand why the GrapheneOS Foundation can't keep maintaining GOS on Pixel devices, while also collaborating with other manufacturers than just Motorola (which is a $77,000,000,000 multi-national corporation) towards more decentralized hardware that can serve their needs while also having the ability to be manufactured by multiple vendors in a white label way.

Relying on Google or Motorola for everything will eventually lead to the same issues, which is platform lock out. I have no confidence that the Motorola deal will fix everything forever.

I refuse to believe that the most secure OS can't be installed on the most OSH.