I am italian, and the main messaging platform here is WhatsApp. I didn't completely quit, i just said "Hey, i want to not use it as much, so don't expect me to instantly answer", and that was the deal for a while. Then, i suddenly convinced the most important friends to switch including my mom, and now i can confidently say i could potentially delete my WhatsApp account and wouldn't loose on much. However i've been thinking and i feel like an asshole for making them switch. They say it's not an issue for them, but still feels like such a selfish thing to do. I am immensely against Meta, i do not trust their app, especially since it's closed source and most of their revenue is literally data trafficking, but i also feel like a bit of a paranoid crazy guy. I love Signal and chose that as a platform mainly because they have no telemetry, no ads, no AI bs, it's fully open source and incredibly user friendly (only annoyances are the centralization which is kinda necessary for the ease of use and the mobilecoin stuff, but it is not a biggie since it's opt in and you'd have to specifically seek out for it unlike the Brave Rewards in Brave for example). What do you think?

No you shouldnt.

Why shouldn’t they feel like “assholes” forcing you to use WhatsApp umin the first place? I quit WhatsApp years ago. Everyone I know uses either Signal or Telegram (still better than Meta).

Don’t overcomplicate things. Just stick to what you feel is right.

In some countries, WhatsApp is the main tool of communication. When I visited Chile years ago, companies had WhatsApp logos on all of their ads, billboards and storefronts. So I get why it’s so difficult to ditch it in those places.

why feel bad for suggesting objectively better software?

They say it's not an issue for them,

So you think your family and friends are liars and shouldn't be trusted?

no retreat, no surrender

over here in America, we had a friend in our group that outright refused to switch to signal. Not to make it seem like it's the only factor, but that friend is no longer around, and we all use Signal.

No way

Signal is good. In the meantime, check out Prav.

https://prav.app/

It's not like you cut their phone wires, should they need it for something they can just use it (as sometimes it's unavoidable). But this way important and private stuff will remain as such, we don't want Zuckerbot to get a hold of grandma's secret recipe, do we?

If no one starts the change, nothing ever will change. Someone has to go through the hassle so others can follow.

Its not selfish to convince your family to do what's in their own best interests.

I think XMPP is great, but if we can't get those closest to us to even use Signal, I don't think an even more convoluted system will be easier.
What makes Prav different from all the other XMPP apps?
Edit: Never mind. The convenience of using a phone number is the difference. Which is no doubt easier.

I gave up on signal just because when I swapped none of my friends did, so therefore, there's no reason for me to use it because I'm just partying by myself.

Being said if you got people to actually go with you then I wouldn't feel bad about it because obviously they wouldn't have swapped if they didn't want to.

It's not as easy to answer as all these comments suggest and especially when it come to contact with family and friends. Honestly you've done well to get some to switch but I would personally keep WhatsApp for now as backup and see how it goes with Signal.

It sounds innovative, but at a subscription I don't know about that one, chief.

Any benefit you gain in being able to use a phone number is going to be thrown out because I don't think anyone's going to pay for a messaging client.

You're doing them a favor by displacing some of the data that Meta would otherwise have on them

Don't give up on Signal. I did the same with my friends and family years back (about 5 years ago) it's been great

If you leave them to choose between WhatsApp and Signal, they'll pick what they already have and what they're familiar with. I deleted WhatsApp after they introduced MetaAI, and told people close to me, that they could only message me using Signal going forward. Just make sure you support people that have difficulty installing and using the app. When removing malware from my grandma's smartphone, I also made sure to install Signal, and she now comfortably contacts me through it for minor things. It's not like you're inconveniencing them much: it's just an app installation and basic setup, while the workflow is nearly identical; especially if you allow them to find you through your phone number (which I have disabled).

End thread

It's not selfish. Data protection protects THEM as well.

Yeah, gotta start somewhere. It’s just crazy how Meta got their claws in with WhatsApp.

https://wire.com/en/

https://briarproject.org/

https://delta.chat/

https://retroshare.cc/

https://github.com/FossifyOrg/Messages

https://www.linphone.org/en/

https://berty.tech/

..... etc.

all OpenSource and privacy focused/encrypted/P2P

I've started replying to any meta site link with this sticker I found on signal

If people knew how meta treats their customers, then they won't (I hope) stay there.

Brother, using an open-source (free) messenger is good. Using proprietary, closed-source is bad. I deleted Whatsapp 1 year and a half ago. Told people they can find me on Signal or normal RCS/SMS messaging. Some came to Signal, the majority started contacting me on rcs/sms. However, now we can talk to Whatsapp people from an European messenger (Arnacon). Unlike BirdyChat and Haiket, it doesn't require to be downloaded only from Google Store. And I prefer it to Google-Google Messages.

I'm on Signal, if someone wants to reach me they can find me there.

I'm okay with not being instantly available to dozens of people.

Cropped version.

Horrible resolution though...

Who are Meta's customers though? I assume it's the shareholders in which case I imagine they're being treated just fine.

IMO it's better in a sense that one may do damage vs one that would not

However i’ve been thinking and i feel like an asshole for making them switch.

You should definitely not feel like an asshole for getting them on a safer app. You moved them off a predatory app. That's good. I convinced my mom to get off Whatsapp because Meta kept trying to scam her into using the AI bullshit.

With Signal, it's just messages. No ads, nothing trying to trick you into doing something against your benefit. It's just messaging. That's all she cares about.

OR carry on using WhatsApp on Beeper for now. https://www.beeper.com/ You can start using Signal and WhatsApp at the same time using Beeper, and start a slower transition by convincing your contacts to do the same.

Tell me more about > Arnacon. Can you connect to WhatsUp users?

Whatsapp: Meta

Signal: CIA

¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

It doesn't matter, tho. After decades of psyops, false flag terror, and both state and para state corruption, Italy became the most loyal vassal state in Europe for the US. The data you could protect from them are already in their hands.

Yes, if you live in European Union. And if they activate interoperability with Arnacon in account settings in Whatsapp.

I don't even use an chat app in my Phone, when i want to communicate with my family or friends, I'do it in the old school methode with a call or an SMS/MMS, alternatively in a bar or at home with some beers, same as before phones without cable. I don't need more than this.

"Signal: CIA"

Seems unsubstantiated

Thanks for list!

Thanks for clarifying, dragospirvu75@lemmy.ml

https://www.kitklarenberg.com/p/signal-facing-collapse-after-cia

WhatsApp does a lot of damage. Even if they don’t read your messages (there is no evidence that they can’t, since WhatsApp is proprietary), they at the minimum know who you talk to and when, and they use that data across Meta services to track you.

How about Matrix? (Element X)

It isn't an argument, because there are almost 50 chat alternatives out there, it's like saying you have to use VW or BMW. To communicate with unknown people there are forums or an fediverse instance like Lemmy or Mastodon, If you want to communicate with your friends or family any of the above proposed chats is enough, or use your phone for what it is, to make a call (yes, this finction still works in smartphones without any app).

Asking someone to add an additional free messaging app is maybe a 2 out of 10 on the effort scale, where 1 is "hand me that thing that's next to you" and 10 is "give me one of your kidneys".

You shouldn't feel bad about asking anyone who claims to care about you for such a small favor even if it didn't benefit them, but as others have already mentioned, it does.

Signal, and (probably) Whatsapp have end-to-end encryption. It's better to feed less information into mass surveillance systems when you can.

wife: I hate that every time we talk about stuff I get ads about it, it's too creepy.

me: move to signal, here's my singal ID

wife: *sigh mabye tomorrow

REPEAT ABOVE 30 times

wife ok, let me install it

wife: adding you

we never text, or fb, or anythig, just signal

no more creepy ads.

Fossify isn't encrypted. It looks worse than RCS.

I had everyone move to matrix and it was really a struggle to keep it working and usable, and now we switched to Signal which is a much easier user experience.

What was your main problems?

End thread

Mainly recovery key issues, notifications which suddenly didn't appear as they used to, and downtime. But I can't say eactly what it was, I just know that everyone is more happy with Signal.