You...think engineers get to pick the product requirements?... That's not how anything works.

So, is GOS, like purposely saying "fuck the poors?" Why spend resources getting flagships when they need to focus on budget phones. Unless they dont give a shit about expanding privacy phones to everyday people.

not the person you replied to, but i assume things like headphone jack, sdcard support, no insane camera bump, repairable design, saner price

in addition i wish for stuff like smaller size, LCD instead of AMOLED, no pinchhole/notch. yeah ik that's impossible these days..

Always with the perfectionism with better alternatives.

This is why I keep a pixel 3.

They design the phones. They chose not to have 3.5mm jacks in those devices. Thats not how it works?

What im trying to say is

Phone manufacturing companies from the CEO level all the way to the phone designers/engineers arent putting 3.5mm jacks in those devices. They dont want them.

From what I have seen, the last Motorola Signature was €999 (~$1,136 USD or $1,606 CAD). So not a cheap device at all.

Source: https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobile/motorola-signature-27-coming-to-the-us-rival-samsung-galaxy/

The contactless payments would be a huge step. If Linux phones could get the actual phone functionality working on most models, that would be nice too. I desperately want what we were promised with Ubuntu Phone like 15 years ago. A functional phone with convergence would be fantastic.

Qualified ones? 😆

Engineers are probably the last people who would get to make that decision though. Even if they argued and threatened to resign over it they may fail to get any deference on such a decision. Unless they could successfully argue that for a technical reason they should keep it or add it. Which obviously doesn't make sense, they already have many designs without it to iterate on.

Such as?

I assume you mean a 3a, I don't believe the 3 still had a headphone jack. I held on to my 4a for as long as I could, but after their battery shenanigans it only lasted a few hours is very light use.

Qualified ones

So like I said, regardless if they get to decide or not, "they aren't building them in".

The company has decided not to put that hardware into the phones. The company doesnt want it. The conpany is not employing 3.5mm enthusiasts. The company doesnt like your ungrounded analog hardware being plugged into their digital inputs. The company has decided to allow USB-C adapters to fill the void of people who want to use analog equipment. The company hires people, but obviously they dont have anyone saying " ohhh what are we doing? We need to give TrickDacy a headphone slot!!"

Thats not how it works? Because im pretty sure thats how it works.

AFAIK they have very strict hardware requirements, so budget phones might not make it. Even the pixel 11 is not confirmed to have support due to some missing features https://cybernews.com/tech/pixel-11-hardware-support-for-mte/

Other roms and even forks of gos support more budget ones.

It doesn't really matter that much I was just pointing out that you had specifically said the engineers weren't adding a headphone jack as if to give gravitas to this decision, but they don't actually make it. That's all.

looking expensive 😮‍💨

Lol they are working directly with the company.

They just need to add a 2€ TPM chip and the rest is mostly software/firmware work.

Pixel is breaking the support on purpose, graphene had a chance to bring that to budget phones, but likely got strong-armed by Lenovo saying "only for a flagship or no deal" or something.

USB-C ports typically rated for 10k mating cycles

3.5mm ports typically rated for 5-10k mating cycles.

Looks like we have our winner.

Should I point out some engineers that have a say to counter you now? Or are we just going to pretend that engineers never have a say on how they engineer?

Just take the L. You're wrong. Engineers don't decide featureset unless they also happen to occupy another role in the company. Jesus.

Also it's funny how you've gone from "I'm right engineers decide it all" to "it doesn't matter who decides it" and now we're back to the former because you googled some atypical cases..?

Answer me this, what do engineers do?

They take a list of features given to them by product people who have gathered the requirements from all the interested parties. They then attempt to design all the technical architecture to support those features. They typically wouldn't decide anything not related to technical aspects. Such as "this is impossible because of x, y, z" or "this is very expensive to do so I don't recommend it". It's a push and pull but if an engineer ever said "we're doing this feature because I want it", typically that would be strange and they would not get their way.

Why do you ask? I am quite confused by this exchange.

Too late, I have depicted myself as the chad Analog Resistance and you as the virgin Digital Republic lol

Over $1000 but no headphone jack?? It's such a basic request for a privacy based phone

I know you're confused, thats why Im explaining this to you.

Lets take a look at an Apple hardware engineer job posting:

https://jobs.apple.com/en-us/details/200685079/hardware-systems-design-electrical-engineer-iphone

Those responsibilities could include designing or validating a connector if that connector falls within the engineers area. But a decision like adding or removing the headphone jack is more than just them.

Engineers figure out whether a 3.5mm jack fits, design its electrical connections, test its reliability, and recommend keeping/removing it.

But they still "build it in".

Ill take the L on saying the word engineer and you getting nit picky then backing off when I nit picky back, then you downplay my reponses as " dude you just googled this stuff like 5 minutes ago" because you know engineers build in USB-C ports and exclude 3.5mm jacks from their plans and get exhausted defending your argument that... Well i don't even know how to explain what you're arguing... That engineers arent involved with decisions? Even though that Apple post clearly says that the engineers must "own" their designs?

Happy for you bro. Truly.

There are other options and also a neutered pixel camera somewhere but I cant find it again unfortunately.

I'll probably get downvotes but the phone is SO ugly

GrapheneOS isn't even mentioned on the product page, strange.

As far as I know, the problem is that Lenovo doesn't make the SOCs that actually implement the security features GrapheneOS requires; Qualcomm does (assuming this phone uses a Snapdragon chip - I didn't check). And Qualcomm only puts these security features into the most powerful SOCs, which are themselves only appropriate for flagship phones.

I hope that some day more budget SOCs will get these security features too so that more people can reap the benefits, and I hope Graphene is pushing for this too, but I don't think we'll see it any time soon.

That being said, I'm just happy Graphene has any partnership at all. One step at a time; once these phones are done they can focus on expanding their offerings more.

Oh my god that is ugly as shit it looks straight out of 2006

Even the cheap motos have headphone jacks, but I guess that's to much to ask.

but the 5 cameras (6 with front) are soo worth it, right

It's not a privacy based phone. It's a phone they're hoping to sell to mass market consumers that so happens to be about to run a privacy based OS.

You are not the target audience and will continue to not be unless people like you become the dominant consumer of such a device. The problem is the people who enjoy this community, by and large, own a pixel 3 and won't purchase anything unless it's got every feature they want.

Even more unfortunately is those features only end up on cheap phones because manufacturers correlated them with poor people. Need a headphone jack? Must be too poor to afford Bluetooth headphones. Need an sd card slot? Must be too poor to afford a cloud subscription or bigger phone. Need a removable battery or to repair your device? You obviously can't afford to buy a new phone every 2 years.

The bottom line is you are all too sensible to spend the money and influence design decisions so this is what you get.

It won't come with it

Is it? The camera lenses are a bit off-putting but it's a slab with circles on the back like every other phone since the mid 2010s

As someone who's been a hardware engineer at Apple and left specifically because I saw they were getting rid of the headphone jack, it is not the engineers that get to make those kinds of decisions. The decision to remove the headphone jack was so they could sell you $100+ air pods that would then also work with your Apple Watch. It was not because there was no space or that ingress protection was unachievable, or it cost to much, or people didn't want it. Trick Dacy is right.

By the way, I rock a Linux phone now with a headphone jack, removable battery, microSD, and have an Android with a headphone jack, microSD as my backup. If the Fairphone 6 had a headphone jack, which is the #1 requested feature on every forum post I've seen, it would be the perfect phone, especially given it can have both Android and Linux on it.

Why would Android phones remove headphone jacks then?

To sell wireless headphones for $100+, higher revenue per person, and provide a non dorky way to listen to stuff through your smartwatch. All of them have wireless earbuds and smart watches. You need to replace them when the non removable battery dies so it's really a wireless headphone subscription. Apple's practice for the watch were the two final iPod nanos. Attaching it to your wrist with a headphone cord running up your arm looked dorky. Apple doesn't do dorky, Android OEMs didn't want smartwatches with headphone jacks to look dorky either. And Android OEMs often copy Apple because Apple is the more stylish one

This is awesome; first non-google phone supported. It us a bit on the expensive side for me, but a good step in the right direction.

Hopefully they will be able to get Motorola/Qualcomm to have the required security features on a lower end SoC and hence phone.

Oop just saw your edit on the other post about the Fairphone. Why does Fairphone keep the 3.5mm jack but also sell Fairbuds?

Sorry yes. The fairphone removed the headphone jack in their phones awhile ago. They now sell wireless earbuds, which goes completely against their purported philosophy.

So you have options..? And because it's still profitable either way.

They literally just said the answer. Which I think was obvious tbh. Apple (and Google) literally sell the most losable objects ever made for $200+. They are greedy capitalists. Of course they're gonna try to push you into that.

Are you trolling? You're now trying to explain to me that engineers don't get to decide the features? Literally what I said from the beginning. If you're high or something that's cool but don't be so confident in an argument. This was...weird

A phone repair shop could pop in a new battery. It wouldn't be secure to use on the internet, but it'd be a good mp3 player :)

sure, like those supporting Palestine, doesn't make them wrong. I hate not having a headphone jack, my Etymotic ear buds are 20 years old and still work superbly.

Yeah seems kind of odd that they would do that.

I also noticed the Motorola Moto G Stylus 2026 has a 3.5mm port, but the GrapheneOS phone from Motorola will have removed the 3.5mm port. Motorola sells their own buds. Doesnt seem like a uniformed decision across the company to remove the jack on all models. Im curious who is making the decisions on those products.

buy a used one in 4 years and get the battery replaced ?