Being the age I am, I’m just old enough to remember flip-phones.

A relatively simple concept that has been on my mind lately for reasons I’ll get to. Widely considered obsolete unless you just want a cheap phone to make calls etc., these phones featured a screen on one side, a keypad on the other, with a hinge joint between the two.

The reason that this device has been dragged back to the front of my brain in recent weeks is because I am reminded of them every time I see this:

To be clear: I’m aware that this foldable iphone is not the first foldable modern smartphone (I know Samsung released them years ago also).

But I’m also left wondering: what is the point? I think I can perfectly understand the use of flip phones as they were when they were popular, but foldable phones I just can’t see the benefit. As far as I can see, these foldable type of phones offer little to no benefit that you couldn’t get from, say a regular iPhone or Samsung phone, in terms of the consumer and how they are used in general life. I get that the hardware/software may be different, but that’s not going to be a factor in most people’s daily lives (you’re not going to care about the type of core, or the screen resolution when you make a phone call, etc.) It seems like it’s more of a gimmick from the companies making them to try and make more sales, but even if that’s the case, the product must have something unique to offer, so what is it about foldable phones that are so unique besides the gimmick of folding?

No point.

We basically hit the ceiling with phones ten years ago.

There's no way to improve them without a massive shift in technology [think the shift from prop planes to jets]

Now they have to come up with new gimmicks to convince people to upgrade.

It's like 1950's Detroit putting bigger and bigger fins on cars that were basically the same as the 1930's technology.

That’s what I suspected.

you’re not going to care about the type of core, or the screen resolution when you make a phone call...

It's not really a phone anymore. It's a portable pocket computer. Being able to unfold a larger screen makes sense for a portable pocket computer.

The iPhone Duo (pictured above) makes a good case. It's a 5.4" phone and iPhone users have been calling for a sub-6" phone for years. Now they can get one, albeit at $1999 to start. Then it opens up to a tablet-sized device for media consumption. So it's convenient.

I think there's a greater point to be made here, and it's the folding screen itself. I think it's a modern marvel of technology, and it would not advance like it has without mass adoption. Folding phones are pushing that, so the tech is getting better. I don't really see much of a point for it, but I'm glad it exists and a mass market product is driving costs down, and R&D up.

There are a lot of neat things the Duo does, but none of them are essential to what I do, and certainly not for the cost. For example, I do use StandBy, the iPhone feature where if it's charging and it's on its side, it turns into a clock. The Duo does it in "tent" mode, which means it's open halfway and it's standing on its sides, with its hinge up in the air. The outer screen displays the clock face. Problem is, a regular iPhone can do the same thing with a FlyGrip, a PopSocket, or a $1 picture frame or plate holder you got at Goodwill. I have a $9 phone stand I use at my bedside.

I think it's funny that Samsung and other Android OEMs have been making them for years, but now that Apple is also making them, people are starting to ask questions. Maybe they had the questions before, but they weren't worth the time to ask when their brand wasn't making them. And that's fair. Unlike Android, iOS doesn't exist to vacuum up all your personal data and sell it to advertisers. So it's perfectly reasonable to be skeeved out by the advertising company that makes phones and the phone OS everyone else uses. Samsung isn't an ad company, but they have to include all the data collecting bits. Gods forbid they make their own OS. Oh wait, they did, it was called Tizen and nobody wanted it.

But if someone could simply buy a bigger phone that fits well in the pocket and is comfortable to carry around, that’s also cheaper and can do pretty much everything the foldable one can do in terms of function (which you can buy) why would you pay extra for one that folds, just because it folds?

I think it’s funny that Samsung and other Android OEMs have been making them for years, but now that Apple is also making them, people are starting to ask questions

To be fair, I did have questions back then, I just didn’t have Lemmy lol. Thanks for your share.

I don't know about you, but I can't fit an iPad Mini in my pants pocket but I can absolutely fit a folded in half iPad mini in my pocket. That is the point of folding.

What Is an iPad mini? Is it a phone though? I thought it was a tablet? I meant more like the iPhone pro max line, or the Samsung equivalent

Is an iPad mini a phone though?

See my previous comment re: portable pocket computer

Well I was asking about phones in the post. See up top

What exactly are you not understanding about my previous comments?

As the owner of a fold6 I can tell you that one of the reasons I got it is that it could replace the occasional tablet use when you need more space eg maps and pictures.

In that, it succeeded quite well. However, everything is now optimized toward the standard phone format so it's nice but not really that important.

Would I buy a phone with a foldable display again? No, because after 22 months with like 1 fold a day the protection already comes off (replacing it is only 20€ if paid but I have to go on a field trip to get it made) and the price for the device is just not worth it.

So next time standard format again.

Slop for the sloptumors.
Flimsy expensiv gadgets that will be replaced by a new model in less than a year, an even more expensive one no doubt.
Fodder for the ever hungry god of capitalism, for if it stops eating it will cease to exist. A single speck in an unending stream of shit.

iPads are not pocket computers. No iPad has ever been designed to fit in a pocket as like a phone, so I don’t understand how you’ve arrived at the comparison of a foldable phone to an iPad in terms of size and fitting it in your pocket when iPads are a tablet computer that are not designed to fit in a pocket. I’m not doubting that iPad minis are computers, they’re just not by nature portable pocket computers, so I don’t quite understand why you’re drawing the comparison given that nobody puts iPad minis in their pockets (and if they do they are using them wrong because as far as I’m aware, they’re not designed to do so)

I don't get it either. Seems like mostly just a novelty item. I sometimes get the feeling that smartphones have become pretty much as good as they can get in this current form and manufacturers are just trying to come up with imaginary problems to solve in order to stand out somehow.

Just buy any mid-range Android (or and older iPhone) and you'll get a great device that does everything it needs to and you can stop thinking about whatever the next year's release does marginally better than the device you have now and use that mental energy on something else.

It's like oreos. These are the "double stuff" smartphones, haha.

Untill the tech improves, nothing.

I've seen three foldey phones in the wild, and they all had a smattering of problems; dead pixels along the foldey bits, cracked plastic along the foldey bits, scratches on the non-foldey bits because shrapnel gets in between the screens, ect...

If we had just kept working on the keyboard slidey phones, we'd have pocket terminals by now, but the keyboard died and was replaced with software...

Edit: typos

You are so close! You see, there are people that would like to have an iPad mini in their pocket, but its too big. These are the people who want the folding iPhone. Check this out, when unfolded, the new iPhone has almost the same size screen as ...the iPad Mini!

The same could be said of the iPhone 18 pro max: it’s only like an inch and a bit less wide, so not that different really

It does seem like you’re being wilfully obtuse here but for the benefit of the doubt I think the point is that the folding phone gives you the screen real estate and added functionality of an iPad mini while still fitting in your pocket, so having the convenience of a phone. Of course nobody currently puts an iPad mini in their pocket, because nobody has pockets that big.

For avoidance of doubt, I am similarly of the opinion that foldable phones are stupid gimmicks, but then I said that about the iPhone 3 so what do I know.

I’m not saying you don’t have a point btw I get what you’re trying to say, I just don’t think it’s worth the money for the size difference to be honest. The average cost of the iPhone 18 pro max is around $1,300, and the average cost of the duo is closer to $2,000. I get that the price will drop for the duo, but right now, I just don’t see the point of spending $800 more on 1.5 inch extra screen width for a device that can’t functionally do much more that any other iPhone as far as I’m aware, and I’m sure I’m not the only one out there.

I just don’t think it’s worth the money. The average cost of the iPhone 18 pro max is around $1,300, and the average cost of the duo is closer to $2,000. I get that the price will drop for the duo, but right now, I just don’t see the point of spending $800 more on 1.5 inch extra screen width for a device that can’t functionally do much more that any other iPhone as far as I’m aware, and I’m sure I’m not the only one out there. And to be clear: when I say functionally can’t do more, I mean in terms of the functionality of the phone (make calls, play games, browse the internet, etc.) rather than functionality in terms of folding.

My (adult) son has had a Samsung Fold for several years now and really likes it.

For him, it's basically a phone and tablet combined, and he no longer uses a separate tablet.

It's also good for running two apps side by side, and I see him doing that a lot (you can setup app groups that automatically launch together on each half of the inside screen).

Flip phones were great!

The form factor itself isn't bad, it's just pretty unusable with all the durability issues. It's also too large, until they are thinner, they are more cumbersome to use as a phone.

Once they are durable, thinner and much cheaper, they will probably become very popular.

Remember before everyone had a smartphone, boomers would sometimes bring a 10 inch tablet to your kids ballet recital and hold it up obnoxiously above everyone's heads to record? We all want to relive that.

More seriously, it's for people who want the portability of a phone with the size of a tablet. Not something I want, but to each their own.

For all the naysayers - I've wanted a fold since the S4 (2014ish) when Samsung demo'd two S4's hinged together.

Being able to double screen real-estate when needed (eg having a tablet sometimes) but carrying it in a phone-sized device makes lots of sense.

And having double the physical space inside offers an opportunity for better heat management - if only to shift the battery to the other side (also means you can fit a physically larger battery).

Lots of potential, but also lots of hurdles to overcome. Unfortunately they've all focused on making the screen seamless first, rather than making the software seamless first.

I have a new motorola razr.

Mainly I just think it is neat, but I do like the little screen on the outside. Ive actually noticed my screentime has decreased a lot. Its something about that extra step of opening it up and being able to handle little things on the small exterior screen.

I like how it fits in my pocket when folded compared to a normal phone

Another small thing is that I can set it up half folded to hold my flashlight while working or act as a camera tripod.

Battery is really good too. I'm not sure if it can just fit more battery or if the small exterior screen limits battery usage when closed, or both.

I think the point is to make them bigger so they can start selling smaller ones in the hear future and keep the endless cycle of "New" phones going on forever, like a subscription but with extra steps.

I guess it also depends heavily on what/how you want to use it. Like, most of that stuff probably wouldn’t be of much if any benefit to me, but I can see that it clearly is to some people, whether that’s at work or just in general life.

Sure, and for the most part I totally agree, though in fairness greater screen real estate is extra functionality, and iPads can do things iPhones can’t.

But your question was what’s the point, and I think it’s been answered. Whether they offer value is another question, and I don’t think many people are disagreeing with you that no, they don’t really.

Yes, this is the answer and it's not that hard to understand.

What is hard to understand is the value proposition. Flips are more expensive for a lower spec device, and they're very unreliable--they're still breaking alot; wouldn't expect more than 2 years out of one.

For most people in the pocket computer market, their needs would be more economically served by a high end phone and a mid tablet, or a high end tablet and mid phone, both items having a naturally longer life than a flip, and will each be used less, and are individually replacable.

All-in-all, flip phones are a fine concept, but at their price point and longevity, they don't make a ton of sense for most people. Just easier to carry a tablet or put up with the smaller screen.

Lots of tablets can be used as phones, if they have a baseband modem.

It is a gimmick. I think people just like the "wow" factor and ignore every other aspect of the phone. Some people complain about phones being too big now and so their justification is to get this phone and then... fold it.

From a practicality standpoint, makes no sense. Even more idiotic than the notch design phones had for a while. Screen protectors don't make sense for that phone. Neither do cases. From an industrial design perspective... and what people seem to ignore is that phones are just small enough computers. Try opening one and take a look... all those parts are not meant to be folded. They will have a finite limit and it will eventually cause problems.

I would much rather just get an actual flip phone.

If I had one, I'd use the larger screen area as an e-reader.

It is a consumer good. If people consume it, the point is to fulfill that demand. To them it probably seems useful to have a phone and a tablet in one device. The unfolded screen size simply doesn’t fit in one’s pocket.

Doesn’t suit me; sounds like it doesn’t suit you either, but the point isn’t a mystery, I believe.

though in fairness greater screen real estate is extra functionality, and iPads can do things iPhones can’t.

To be fair though, that’s because iPhones and iPads have different hardware and slightly different operating systems. iPad architecture is closer (but not extremely close) to pc type computers, it’s called IpadOS, whereas iPhones run on standard iOS which is less powerful.

Yes but iPads run on IpadOS, where as iPhones run on standard IOS, which is less powerful.

Back in the day, flip phones were nice as they fit in your pocket.

If you want to move the goalpost, sure, but standard tablets don't fit in your pants pocket.

To be clear, I'd never spend that much money on a phone or tablet and it's fucked up that this is supposed to be the new standard iPhone.

I mean I suppose it’s possible that they could integrate the iPadOS into smartphones at some point, but we all know why they’re not going to do that…

I've had one of the smaller Samsung foldables for almost 2 years now. I hate Samsung's software experience, but the hardware is actually pretty great due to the half size in the pocket. Im having issues with my screen protector now right at the hinge now and need to see about getting it replaced and I used the phone on a river in a dry bag once and ended up getting a piece of sand in it early on so there is an annoying little spot on the screen protector from that too so I avoid putting the phone in more rugged environments now.

TLDR: So yeah, best thing is a smaller device to carry around but other issues with them.

Sometimes you want a larger screen for media or multitasking.

Or in the case of the flip-phone form factor, you want a phone that you can put away or fit in a smaller pocket/purse.

Oh, and Calendar, Clock, Camera, and a markdown shopping list on the cover screen without opening the phone is nice.

If the doubt you have in your mind was about the value for money, then you asked the wrong question. And the reason this thread got so long is because you didn't clarify your doubt initially when it became obvious that there was a good reason to want a folding smartphone.

True, very true. However, I do think that the size links in with what I was eventually getting at with the cost, but yeah, I probably could’ve brought it up earlier.

My fold is narrower and fits in my pocket better while also being more or less a tablet for work. No regular phone matches its functionality.

It’s the same thing with a different skin. It’s the hardware that’s powerful or not, not the software.

What the actual fuck are you talking about?

First off, hardly anyone under 50 uses a phone for calling any longer. It’s now a portable computer. I want a device in my pocket with a small footprint most of the time, but when I need a big screen for getting work done, I no longer need to carry around a tablet too. I can just unfold my phone and see a spreadsheet. Or take notes with a stylus. Or make some doodles. Or share a video with my wife or parents more easily that they can actually see.

So, it’s one device that has multiple functions in different forms. It also means I no longer need to have a ~$1200 phone and a ~$900 iPad mini, I can get both in a single $2000 device.

There are some companies making flip phones for the disconnected folks, if your primary need is a phone, go for it. The commodore one actually looks pretty cool.

Pro Max $1300
iPad mini $800

Total $2100

Hey I just saved $100 and I can carry my iPad mini with me all the time now.