the person you replied to said:

they [the US] didn’t win wwii, the soviets did.

the original claim was not that the soviets won single-handedly. they were responsible for taking on 70-80% of the german war effort.

Too bad the axis was made up of more than Germany.

Losing 11 million to 4 million is , frankly, awful and the only reason they didn’t lose completely was that they had the numbers.

soviet POWs were systematically murdered rather than held as prisoners. this was a war of extermination and qualitatively different from every other theater. very different from conventional warfare, a significant portion (on the order of 3+ million) of those 'military' deaths were just starving or working prisoners to death.

And that's fucking awful, it still doesn't mean that the Soviets, and only the Soviets won the war.

and that's not what was said, that was your spin for the pity thread

Too bad the axis was made up of more than Germany.

even accounting for all axis partners, the eastern front absorbed the vast majority of axis military capacity throughout the war.

the original claim was not that the soviets won single-handedly, from what i can tell it was that the US did not.

"the US didn't win the war, the Soviets did"

You've quoted that to me twice as if I responded that the US won the war, which I never did. I said it was a group effort because it was. You seem to think it was only a European war and not a world war. Do we need to break down the Pacific theater now and break down the contributions there? Or can you accept the fact that the World War was a group effort?

the original claim was not that the soviets won single-handedly, from what i can tell it was that the US did not.

"The US didn't win the war, the Soviets did". You've quoted it to me twice now.

it was a group effort, but the US didn't win it; the soviets did.

it was a group effort, but the US didn't win it; the soviets did.

it was a group effort

A statement completely negated by

but the US didn't win it; the soviets did.

Also, I never said or even implied that the US "won the war" because anyone with half a brain knows that the allies (USSR included) won the war.

A statement which contradicts itself.

it's only contradictory if you assume "group effort" means equal contribution...

which is the whole point being contested.

as i said elsewhere, it's only contradictory if you assume "group effort" means equal contribution, which is the whole point being contested.

it's also why you got shouted down for trying to uplift the US's participation beyond what it actually was.

it's only contradictory if you assume "group effort" means equal contribution...

Then Let's talk about the Soviet contribution to the Pacific theater. Or does that not count because it isn't eurocentric?

it's also why you got shouted down for trying to uplift the US's participation beyond what it actually was.

Which I never did no matter how much you want to think I have.

I said "group effort" meaning the allied powers all over the world. I did not say "the US showed up, kicked all the Nazi ass, and won the war" which you seem to think I'm saying.

Girl, I'm not here to downplay the contributions of the USSR nor did I. I'm also not OOP. I know basic history. You already said that you object to calling it a group effort. What was the point of this comment?

Lemmy.ml is a no go zone for those not drinking the eastern fascists wearing a communist mask kool-aid.

I also never downplayed their contribution.

Was not called a world war for nothing.
There were tons of countries on the “Allies” side and tons on the “Axis” side.
A simple search for WWII Allies member or WWII Axis members will show who fought on each side.

There are to many to list here. Britain, Soviet Union, USA, Canada and China to name a few for the allies.

Nazi Germany, Italy, Japan, Republic of Finland, Hungary for the Axis side.

Edit forgot Italy.

Don't forget Italy.

Then Let’s talk about the Soviet contribution to the Pacific theater. Or does that not count because it isn’t eurocentric?

they declared war on japan in 1945 as agreed in yalta; destroyed the kwantung army in manchuria in under a fortnight and were instrumental in forcing the japanese surrender as they lost all hope of a land defense. the kwantung was the primary reserve force for that planned defense.

Thanks, fixed.

i don't want to put words in your mouth and i do wish that your comments didn't get deleted so i could actually assess this.

from the way i read the aftermath, someone said that the US hasn't won a war since wwii, someone else said that it was the USSR who won it, then you showed up to say it was a group effort (tho i can't actually read what you said, inferring it from this post.) in that context it read like minimizing, which is what i saw from the people responding.

To elaborate, they are tankies who believe trans rights are western pink washing. And who larp as Haitian revolutionaries from their ergonomic computer chairs. And who literally do not post outside of their home instance because they can't handle the internet without their "I win" ban button.

Somewhere between 21,000 and 83,000 Japanese losses to Soviet forces compared to compared to 1.2-1.5 million lost to US forces.

Who came in at the last minute there? 🤔

And that's ignoring the contributions from other allied nations in that theater.

Sounds like a group effort, huh?

So you admit you only saw one side of the argument and made assumptions about me? I didn't expect that.

Who came in at the last minute there? 🤔

i mean they were still fighting against a war of extermination at the time.

Sounds like a group effort, huh?

yeah in order of participation against japan it was China, then the US, then the USSR

which is why it's a little silly when people say the US hasn't won a war since WWII; it was junior partner in that group effort.

They also seem to mad that you pointed out Russia was on the Axis side originally and is acting like they were always on the Allied side.

why would you not expect me to be honest?

Because you came in to defend the people I originally had the argument with who called me a Nazi for the grievous sin of calling a world war a group effort.

That might be true if China wasn't completely railroaded by Japan.

Yeah, they would apparently rather we all forgot that tidbit.

i mean as i said, people are sensitive to that, cause the USSR's participation does get dramatically downplayed in the west.

The Soviets raped and killed everything in sight when they entered Romania. They can go to hell with their "help". They fought the nazis, and they took advantage of the rest of us.

Nevermind how they installed a communist regime that ruined romania for like a decade or whatever. Not that communism is bad but that one sure was.

same argument as for the USSR; i don't see how them fighting against a war of extermination makes them killing more japanese than the US less significant.

But they killed significantly less Japanese than the US did.

i feel like you misread my statement. i meant same argument as to why the USSR taking enormous casualties doesn't diminish their war effort.

That's just the admins of lemmy.ml for ya, here's a megathread on them

You'll get banned for showing support for Ukraine or going against Russian narratives or if you remind them of Putlers promise to not invade or just shit talking Putler in general

Or calling out propaganda sites - https://lemmy.world/post/32776038 | https://lemmy.world/post/33416433 | https://lemmy.world/post/34051329 | https://lemmy.world/post/35919522

Or so much more, I actually haven't updated the megathread in a few months, but there's more recent stuff on !meanwhileongrad@sh.itjust.works

ETA - Join the lemmy.ml boycott today and help foster a better Lemmy-verse! No more posts, comments (except to counter their propaganda ofc!) or upvotes on any comms on the Lemmy.ml instance! To make this easy you can do an instance block at Settings > Block Tab > Scroll to bottom > Input "lemmy.ml" and apply And consider donating to individual instances instead.

But I never downplayed it. And let's not act like every non-american (and a good chunk of Americans) on the Internet doesn't downplay the US contribution.

Personally feel that was pretty rational considering the sheer amount of transphobic vitriol those threads always drew. I was tired of seeing them every time I scrolled, and some of the alt spamming transphobia stuff was completely out of hand. If you read the thread you linked announcing it, they also only banned a very specific genre of YPTB thread related to Blahaj, and other posts about Blahaj are still allowed.

Note that this decision isn’t about ideological gatekeeping, its about reducing the workload for our own mods and admins in trying to moderate this community, and to avoid iterating over the same old topics again and again.

Blajah isn’t getting a “free pass” over YPTB posts - if you feel they are power tripping over other issues then feel free to make a post here. But if it’s a post questioning the validity of xenogenders or about Blajah bans for gatekeeping then that will no longer be allowed here.

Feel like you are representing this really unfairly.

That's just nonsense. If it's a group effort, it means that they achieved it together. If I did 70% of a project and someone else did 30%, it was a group effort, and we achieved the goal together.

Gary host is the hardcore tankie mod of .mls memes comm (and a few others iirc)

hahaha yeah amerikkka rly tipped the scales coming in at the very end just in time to claim credit and not actually do shit, liberals 🤣

CoMmUnISm BadDDDddd capitalist daddy said so!

thats just amerikkka rewriting history with their mass propaganda machine haha

I'll admit I don't know as much about the Chinese war effort, but it shouldn't be controversial to criticize the Soviet strategy when it was literally "throw as many bodies at the problem as possible", which it factually was. It also ignores the fact that they were allied with Germany until Germany double-crossed them and had Germany not double-crossed them there's a good chance they would have remained on that side. This is after the Nazis purged the Socialists and Communists in Germany after using them to win control in the first place. So forgive me for not sucking Stalin's dick and taking pity on the USSR for catching fleas from the dogs they went to bed with.

This is not an anti-communism or anti-socialism rant. This is an anti-short sighted opportunist rant.

The USSR played a major role in the war once they joined the allies and I'm grateful for it, but ignoring everything before the German invasion of the USSR is silly and you know it.

The way the Nazis treated Soviet POWs and civilians was abhorrent, but to act like the USSR didn't commit their share of war crimes is just as silly whether you think you can justify it or not. Not to mention how things turned out post-war for many Soviet satellites and Warsaw-Pact countries.

That explains a lot.

This is not an anti-communism or anti-socialism rant.

thats because its not its an imperialist tool with nothing defensive about it, lib worlders man 😒