why would such work require an nda?

there are dozens of ev cars which are simply converted from antique ones Oo

Why should I buy a non-electric car? I think my question got misunderstood.

Their point is that you are just nostalgic for old cars, simpler cars. All modern cars are overcomplicated, EV or not

I think it's a salient point: It's not just EVs. The entire industry has gone whole-hog on the "rolling data center" model.

As to "why" from your post title...well, I assumed it was a rhetorical question to introduce a (short) rant about the sad state of the automobile market.

The images and wording are really vague and I couldn't tell if it was for a head unit or just a bluetooth speaker like the electric microcars do.

Because the company that "builds" the ev converted vehicle actually just designs and sources parts + the vehicle, our shop is the one that actually built them (at least for the USA based clients). I'm not sure the buyer knows it was done by us or not, I'm sure it doesn't much matter. There's only a handful of companies that offer this so it wouldnt be too hard for u to narrow it down to a couple!

They do. Or least they sometimes do. I drive a Kia Soul EV. It’s… a Kia Soul with an electric motor and battery instead of all the internal combustion stuff.

Ah. So it's kind of a secret that they don't do their own work...

Is it just fancy and expensive cars that do this? I have an old hatchback I'd like to convert, but otherwise it would go to the scrapyard.

For the laughs, look up Ford Fusion Energi [sic]. It's a PHEV retrofit, so it has a plug, very short EV range (12 miles? - that is if you can make it run in EV mode), but the best part is the trunk - the entirety of it is taken up by the battery, with enough space for maybe a briefcase, not even a bag of groceries.

Bullshit is pretty strong language, I have a 2015 that phones.

You should check Chevy's lineup. They're pretty ok, the truck is expensive, but what truck isn't?

Cars getting more expensive is in all car companies' interests.

They're getting cheaper actually. The gigantic touchscreen is cheaper than a bespoke interior design with physical buttons for every model.

Of course that's not reflected in the price

no reason! I had a 2017 BMW i3 for five years and now going on five years with a 2022 Taycan wagon, I'm all for BEVs!

It's just that no new cars, regardless of powertrain, are available without the "smart" shit

Does the word “car” mean something different in the USA?

This is like the System 76 of cars.

cheaper for the car maker, not for the end consumer.

yes, but a lot of that overcomplication is for safety at least.

you're much more likely to survive a big car crash in a car from today, then are you are from a car 60 years ago.

Also less likely to lose traction on wet roads and skid off than you were half a century ago.

that isnt meant to say everythings sunshine and roses, like all that equipment that enables spyware bullshit they gather on you and sell to insurance companies and marketers.

the problem is the cars have stopped being a product, and have become a medium to turn you into the product. Which is becoming a problem across many industries and the items they wish you to own.

Then you're an idiot.

because that information is gonna end up in the same markets as the information from anywhere else, and its going to fuck you over in the long term.

You're too obsessed with government jackboots coming to your door to even consider your car and health insurance premiums skyrocketing at best, or getting dropped at worst, because your driving data was sold to them and they decided you were too much a risk despite a clean driving record.

and thats only a small example of what can be done with this data. it could affect a lot more as companies try to analyze you and your actions and catagorize you. or even better, explode your phone with advertising with every store you're driving past.

Sell it to the same people that ford and everyone else are, so it can be used to fuck you over on jobs, insurance, etc etc.

I have a BYD dolphin and it's great!

After growing up with one, I’d rather walk blindfolded on a freeway than drive a Chevy.

Neat. And it looks like it's only 50% more expensive compared to a comparable gas car, which is a huge improvement from the last time I looked.

That's one part of the system.

I mean, I’d rather not be spied on at all, but at least a Chinese collector has to find an American buyer, whereas the American collector is the American buyer. But I agree with you, mass surveillance is bad no matter who is doing it.

Jeff Bezos is one of their prime investors and is selling you a vehicle that requires you to plug your phone into it directly in order to function.

As cool as the rest of the idea sounds that makes it an instant and permanent non-starter for me.

Yeah it’s hard to believe spending that much on a vehicle. I mean, sure there are wealthy people but most of us arent

The problem is they have over done it. To add just one little thing you want boosts the price into the range of say a Chevy Bolt, which is a much more polished vehicle. But I do like the look and the idea. The fact that Amazon (or was it just Bezos?) is involved is as little troubling.

Wow. So it does exist. I'm more surprised about the manual transmission than the windows, to be honest. My wife and I both only drive two door manuals.

KIA is one of the worst offenders regarding continuous surveillance and then selling the data to third parties.

the upcoming slate.

A tip for others:

To ensure your driving data (like braking habits or speed metrics) is completely decoupled from third-party data brokers and insurance exchanges:

• App Settings: Open the Kia Access mobile app, navigate to Account Settings / Privacy, and opt out of all data-sharing programs (specifically anything tied to "Driver Score" or Usage-Based Insurance

Not the same guy, but I've been around a DIY conversion. You can do it to any vehicle you want, but some make more sense than others. Assuming your 'old hatchback' is 80s-90s, probably not a great fit. Like he said the whole thing is really a packaging problem, and that's gonna be rough on a unibody compact. Older, bigger stuff is easier, and I probably wouldn't bother with something that wasn't body on frame. The one I observed myself was a 2000-ish Ford Ranger, and that worked out really well. Two large rectangular battery boxes parallel with the driveshaft between the frame rails under the bed, motor in place of engine, controllers etc in extra space under hood. Total cost ~10k, hours hard to guess but a good winter's worth of weekends

Driving a kia e-niro. There's nothing gimmicky about it except for the melody that plays when you start the car. Everything else is pretty much down to earth regular car stuff. And with a price below 40k, in 2021, I think it wasn't even that expensive for a EV.

The first company that is able to commodify modular drop-in BEV replacements for ICE vehicles would make a fortune:

Battery packs shaped to slot into engine bays, transmission tunnels and fuel tank cavities.

Individual motors directly into your preferred wheel wells (FWD? RWD? AWD? 4WD? whatever you like).

Drop-in ECU to interface with the existing chassis.

The sort of thing that someone mechanically minded could knock out in their own garage over a weekend or two, or you could get done at a professional shop in a day.

Imagine taking your favourite silhouette, and giving it exactly the range and performance you desire - at the fraction of the cost of a new EV.

Yeah that too

Possible, but I've seen a general trend of Chinese websites, companies, etc. that serve a domestic audience having no or very basic cybersecurity because China is a very high-trust society. Then they go global with that attitude and get pwned.

So three issues.

An ICE drivetrain is a certain size and shape- you have a big lump of engine under the hood, a fat cigar of a transmission under the center of the car, a gas tank in the back, etc.
An EV drivetrain has a VERY DIFFERENT size and shape- the entire battery and drive system is essentially a skateboard on top of which you can build the rest of the car.

So you can't just take an ICE car and swap out the ICE for batteries and motor. The whole car needs a redesign. And if you're making the car for modern, tech-savvy buyers, why would you make a boring old low-tech car?

Second- EVERY car is turning into a rolling datacenter like a smartphone. Try to buy a base model car with no screen and manual windows or whatever- it doesn't exist anymore in many brands. Automakers go for the high profit items, and that's NOT the base models.

Third- a lot of the tech is now mandatory. Backup cameras, and soon driver attention monitoring among other things.

Sad thing is- I think there's a demand for it, if the price is right. If getting rid of most of the tech dropped $10-20k off the sticker price I think whoever tried it would sell millions. I'm not sure you're allowed to anymore though.

Seems like Slate can get by with everything removed but airbags. And the price is right.

"Car" in America is any passenger vehicle, it seems.

The gimmick on wheels

I test drove quite many models when Musk did the hitler salute thing to get rid of it, and my conclusion was that the rest were even more gimmicky. Hyundais were close, but unfortunately I need the boot space their models didn't provide.

In ICE cars the base models/brands are no nonsense and you get more of gimmicks as you move up the pricelist. EVs start much higher on the pricelist so they have to include some gimmicks by default to not feel a total ripoff.

In Europe Volkswagen has 3 brands that sell cars built on same platform but they are positioned in three market segments. This made sense for ICE because pricing and features progression worked while parts were shared. Now their EV lineup cost basically the same across all brands because the baseline is so high.

Dacia Spring ?

Dacia is usually pretty much bare bones

My man, same 🤝

Kia Rio, BMW coupe, 350Z --> all manual

EV have hit 25k now. I think to hit 15k they'll be throwing out these gimmicks with gusto. Gimmicks are to show off the price

In the home electronics store I nearly asked if they had any TVs that weren’t smart, nearly.

Better crumple zones and airbags are most of the advances in safety compared to 60 years ago. Traction control and anti-lock brakes are pretty rad too. Automatic braking and lane assist account for some though I think they're a net detriment, training drivers to be less attentive (this is somewhat supported by the rise in pedestrian deaths).

All the spyware and extra shit is pure downside. Mandatory internal face tracking is fucking maddening and I shan't be cooperating with such overreach. Nothing newer than like 2014, maybe an import from a different market without them.