it’s a really bad PR move to broadcast that opinion online.

what the fuck is this mentality

He's talking about forum posts calm down

tends to be that way when a lot of us aren't western

this about sums up my experience.

more often than not when i do encounter misogyny or transphobia it's coming from someone off-instance and it's taken care of when pointed out.

To me it was a matter of getting tired of imperialist and bigoted stuff, before that I used one that styles itself as apolitical, naively thinking they'd be at least somewhat better than Reddit. But nope, same reactionary, racist shit.

yeah... my bad

What's the story with the bean posting? I'm new to the Lemmiverse.

It was the first instance.

I joined lemmy because I was a big proponent of federated networks. I had had accounts on other federated networks before this one, some of which died out entirely. (I think the first "reddit-like" network I was on was called prismo? Diaspora is more facebook-like and still exists.) I had no clue it was going to get anywhere near as big as it has, and I definitely did not forsee how fucking stupid the instance tribalism would become where new users don't know so just pick one and then seem to be judged for their decision when other members of their community are jackasses in one way or another.

I think overall I'm happy lemmy caught on, but it definitely felt more like a community before the redditors came over. On the other hand, I do think part of the reason it was able to catch on in a way the others weren't was how much it felt like a friendly community here. There was already something with a good culture to migrate to.

Vanilla ice cream

Bean here for 2 years and still don’t know.

They are very much proud of doing it manually. Part of their feeling important in the mowg crusades...

Didn't even mention the transphobia but places like this and bearsite are such an oasis. Even when I do see transphobia it is at least subtler. I'm not seeing slurs thrown around

does .ml support old.?

it's the instance made by lemmy developers, i don't think they host any third party frontend

I’m responding to you, with respect, knowing full well the eventual outcome will probably be that you instance ban me.

there's always a diversity of views, even if some views are more predominant than others because they're encouraged from the top.

How come you seem to allow communities who are moderated by a single user who repeatedly bans people just because they don’t like what someone says in an instant?

Our job is to make allies, patiently educate, and create more caring people.

Are you seeing your instance as a means to patiently persue a certain ideology rather than allowing free speech and open uninterupted and respectful discourse? This is a genuine question, but you’re welcome to ignore it.

I am one of the people you could have persuaded. I think you got very close, until yesterday. Hence this post. One of the mods blinked, and I what I saw what nothing but monolithic thinking, and as a worker, someone who is described by most people in my life as left, I have through the years become more pragmatic and I understand change is gradual and happens in stages. Pedulums swing.

The vast majority of people have good in their heart. Russians, Americans and of course the people from the Federated States of Micronesia. I don’t understand why we need this division, and though you decry it in your comment, through actions or inactions, communities and moderators on your instance are allowed to amplify this division.

To be instant banned for a few paragraphs. Then being name called by that mod, in a community without any rules, and then being banned with the reason ‘Zionist’ while I am just about 180º the opposite is not the way to persuade people like me.

You may have the right intentions, and I have had many people on .ml with whom I have had lovely exchanges. However, the fact is this prejudijice exists and I think at some point, if we actually care about MAU of the fediverse to get some uptake, instead of the current flatlining, having all instance admins setting aside their differences, perhaps making some apologies or demanding apologies, or just even listening to one another, could be a first step.

Your comment reminded me about what someone once said about my personal relationship with a close family member. I listed the challenges, how hard it was to communicate, how I was past the point of all hope to see it ever improving. Then the person said to me: “Good. So what are you going to do about it?”

Thanks for taking this on board in the spirit in which it was intended. And if you are somewhere involved in the development of this platform, thanks for your hard work.

Tell the other instances they were Russian soldiers, they'll get over it

哈哈懂了
挺好的 慢慢来 加油

You know we can see your history right?

Bearsite?

Hexbear

lol, just now noticed them saying shit like "This is a rather neurodivergent absolutist approach hoping for a utopia any smart person know is not achieved within the parameters of today’s power structure." and "You don’t even need a tinfoil hat to see that if .ml is indeed russian made, trump is a russian plant (buy russian oil), then it all makes perfect sense." and basically accusing all of .ml being Russian bots and/or paid actors because some of us are extremely opposed to voting? There's a difference between having a discussion about the effectiveness of voting in helping to stop the genocide in Palestine, and starting to throw about dehumanizing shit and baseless accusations.

edit: oh yeah, and:

I understand this viewpoint. I think it’s less an opinion and more a neurological condition

yes, because we are all autistic and stupid we can't see that the entire instance is controlled by the russians who put Trump in power, and all of this is evidenced by the actions of the mod of a single community and a few strong words, and by the fact some of our users refuse to participate in bourgeois elections in the imperial core. nice.

I’m now seeing Harris apologia and people throwing Palestine and trans people under the bus at over at .world and its getting upvoted.

I’m not trying to start a fight or mud slinging, it would be good if several people could say their piece and nobody shame or attack them for it no matter how much you disagree.

🤥🤥👖🔥🔥🔥

Well run back to the instance that is a 501(c) (3) that's tax exempt, like churches, and possibly takes US federal money, and whinge. Surely a soothed ego and props for your troubles crucifixion is more productive than taking it in and actually learning from it.

This was a very sweet and endearing exchange. I used online translation to read it.

It's always good to encourage people putting in the effort to learn something new

Are you seeing your instance as a means to patiently persue a certain ideology rather than allowing free speech and open uninterupted and respectful discourse?

We have no obligation to platform pro-genocide, patriarchal, white supremacist, cissupremacist, homophobic, or otherwise oppressive speech, and more, we have a moral obligation to silence those bigoted groups, deprive them of their right to speak, and prevent them from spreading their harmful views, and not only for the mental health of our users, of whom many are members of those targeted groups, but because we know that its the modus operandi of these white-supremacist/bigoted groups to set up nazi bars on social media platforms to spread their views, get people to associate and agree with them, and grow. The correct answer has always been, and remains, to deny them a platform.

If other servers, following the line of reddit and other US social media companies, want to platform those views to increase ragebait engagement and their user counts, there's nothing we can do about that, but at least here we can think about the long-term mental health of our users, which is far more important than user counts.

Fediverse instances are like email servers, if they call something spam and don't want to host it, then that's their prerogative. Arguments for "free speech" do not require them to host what you want them to host.

We also don't buy the liberal notion of "free speech", and think that even if there was such a thing, liberal countries and spaces don't actually practice it. Much like all liberal countries have a long history of banning anti-capitalist / anti-imperialist speech, organizing, and communist political parties, the instance you're on also doesn't adhere to "free and open speech": they've blocked the most popular leftist instances in the fediverse (hexbear and lemmygrad), to shield their userbase from those views.

I don’t understand why we need this division, and though you decry it in your comment, through actions or inactions, communities and moderators on your instance are allowed to amplify this division.

We have a be respectful rule here, and we do enforce it with temp bans, however it is unavoidable that some people (especially when venturing outside of lemmy.ml), encounter extremely bigoted and pro-genocide takes, and that makes them understandably angry. Still, if you see people from our instance breaking that rule, then report it, and we'll get to it when we can.

How come you seem to allow communities who are moderated by a single user who repeatedly bans people just because they don’t like what someone says in an instant?

To be instant banned for a few paragraphs. Then being name called by that mod, in a community without any rules, and then being banned with the reason ‘Zionist’ while I am just about 180º the opposite is not the way to persuade people like me.

I don't know the circumstances, so you'd have to be more specific, linking examples. We made the modlog public, and its possible to link to every modded item to see what happened.

I listed the challenges, how hard it was to communicate, how I was past the point of all hope to see it ever improving. Then the person said to me: “Good. So what are you going to do about it?”

Despite ideological differences, and some loud users on other servers demanding more defederations, we actually have good relations with most other fediverse server admins and runners. We don't make demands on each other, each server has full autonomy to take mod actions on both local and federated users, and that autonomy is respected.

I understand this viewpoint. I think it’s less an opinion and more a neurological condition

What the fuck is wrong with that user? Or I guess I should have expected ableism from a lib... just like the rampant homophobia or racism (it's against the right targets after all!!)

The stuff that gets banned on .world news gets posted to .ml news and the stuff that gets banned on .ml news gets posted to .world news.

You need both to get everything, otherwise you end up with too much of a bias from one instance.

You think so? I guess you're right, I'm not forced to participate in this vile capitalist system because I can live under a bridge.

The whole fucking system in rural America all but coerces their enlistment.

Okay if you're not going to sway hearts and minds then what's your plan?

Yeah I know, that's gross too

I respect your consistency

(for those who don't get it: this emoji-combination is miming the children's saying "liar liar pants on fire". sorry if i am ruining it or being too obvious)

Thanks for laying that out.

Hours after my incident, you went in the same community and performed the same action as the community mod. Well, not the same, you used a temporary ban, which I believe is more appropriate. The reason you typed was “rule 1”, but the community doesn’t not list any rules. If you saw my comment you would have banned me too.

From a noob perspective, your communities would greatly benefit from having a “instance rules (linked here) apply”, as right now, a fresh new account wanders into your instance and has no idea, begins a good faith conversation, without realising they have wandered onto a platform where a viewpoint they see as just valid, is completely outlawed.

If I had known that, I would have not followed these communities let alone wasted time trying to have respectful discourse.

I like your email server analogy, I just think we need to have a slightly more universal approach to how the rules of the instance (and how much they matter) are communicated.

The people who are chronically online often assume new users understand the Fediverse or the inner complexities or history, but many see it as just the alternative to reddit, as seen in some responses in this thread. Some blame no doubt falls onto the mobile clients, which possibly need to be updated to allow the distinction between the instances to be clearer before a user views or posts in a community.

Thanks for allowing this discourse.

I wanted an actual leftist instance, not Libs pretending they're left while upholding the worst parts of capitalism and imperialism. I wanted viewpoints outside of the colonial center. I feel like I got what I wanted. They're pretty up front about what you'll find inside.

You're putting some lives above others, in this case the lives consciously doing the path of mass murderers.

Not celebrating the death of pawns does not mean I condone what those pawns are doing. I'm not putting their lives above the people they're killing. You're making a lot of assumptions about me if you came to that conclusion.

I'm not celebrating the deaths of working class people who have been coerced/manipulated into carrying out the imperialists' and capitalists' objectives. Am I sad when they get killed? Perhaps a bit.They shouldn't be where they are and doing what they're doing (They probably didn't even think they'd see combat when they enlisted, nor have they considered what role the US military actually plays in the world). Am I enraged when brown people are killed for absurd reasons? Yes, extremely. It's disgusting that is allowed to happen.

So yes, when an American solider dies, it's still a tragedy, and I'm not going to celebrate that (especially when there's some freaks in .world looking for bad .ml behavior to put on display).

Anglos patting other Anglos on the back as always. 🙄

You getting criticised for being a liberal genocide apologist isn't "leftist infighting"

When my child's school enrolled them in rotc with neither my knowledge nor permission, I raised immortal hell and made them take them right TF out and I was a liberal, then.

Oh it's the account upset people don't like politicians okay with genocide while also saying they know nothing about Israel or Palestine.

And of course world just locked the post the op did there with the similar question. Weird how only the one against free speech didn't lock it 🤔

What the fuck is wrong with that user?

Wild what propaganda can do

I still don't understand what that means. I don't know what instance/s I use. I don't know how to use a different one. I don't know how to properly search across instances. I barely understand that an instance means something technical with accessing stuff.

I really don't know. Deeply unserious person, "ready to debate anyone on this" and the issue is voting? Grow up.

its where all the gay daddies are

I'm not an organization or a figurehead or a celebrity or a politician or a dog

So what I read from it is that .ml folks have a strict set of beliefs one must hold in order not to be crushed under the hateful mob.

If one generally inclines with the set of views, but deviates at any given point, they become a valid target.

This doesn't breed healthy communities and alienates nearly everyone who dares to think for themselves, and yet could be your ally on anything else.

That said, Free Palestine.

If that's what you read then there's no point talking to you because you're just ignoring what is actually being written in order to substitute your own bad faith strawman.