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Bytemeister
lemmy.world
Bytemeister@lemmy.world Joined: 2023-07-29 |
Unless people lie about the ballot. Or they are thrown out. I'm sure there's a digital version of hanging chads.
Bitflips |
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Maeve
kbin.earth
Maeve@kbin.earthJoined: 2024-06-16 |
I'm reasonably sure that the "hanging chads" was only a problem for counting votes for candidates from one of the two parties. I've heard a legend that in a Scottish parliament election, which claims that a ballot is required only to show "clear preference" that a person drew dicks on all but one candidate, over which was written "not a dick". The vote was counted as it showed clear preference.
The point is, people determined on a particular outcome will find novel ways of ensuring that outcome. |
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Bytemeister
lemmy.world
Bytemeister@lemmy.world Joined: 2023-07-29 |
Not only that, it makes selling your vote actually feasible, since you have an easy way to prove who you voted for.
TBF, it's legal to take a picture of your ballot now, so you can sell your vote in other ways. |
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halcyoncmdr
piefed.social
halcyoncmdr@piefed.social Joined: 2026-01-15 |
When it comes to republican election fuckery there are no coincidences.
There are other ways to mess with the counts that aren't going to be visible to the person as they make selections. Like having it show whatever they're selecting properly, then just printing different selections at the end. Not everyone is going to verify the printed copy shows what they selected, and already confirmed on the machine once. Making it jump around on screen isn't discreet at all, and it's not the easiest way to try and interfere. Poorly calibrated touchscreens, and a user interface with inadequate spacing between options are much more likely reasons. We're used to using devices that companies spend a lot of time designing the User Experience on. Voting machines are a very niche industry, with virtually no consumer backlash for a shitty experience because the voter has no direct control, and the government isn't going to be using that interface to handle things like counts at the end. |
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DrPop
lemmy.world
DrPop@lemmy.world Joined: 2024-01-14 |
TN voter here. The poll workers are aware and on point. I was given a warning delivered in a very neutral tone. "Because there are so many options and the options are narrow some people have been noticing when they try to select an option it chooses the one above. Make sure the tip of your finger touches the candidate you are choosing. Double check the candidate you want is selected as a grayed...
I tried looking to see if you can request a paper ballot in Tennessee but keep getting results for absentee ballots. Are you not allowed to request a paper one? |
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Maeve
kbin.earth
Maeve@kbin.earthJoined: 2024-06-16 |
apply to every single employee you coerced this way. I don't think I've ever actually considered the risk that an employer could force people to vote a certain way. I'm far more concerned about people living in abusive relationships. we made it a serious fucking crime to do that. People living in abusive relationship are already victims of serious crimes every day. Yet those crimes often go unr...
We should be concerned about any sort of coercive control. Yes, children, elders, elders, and other vulnerable populations may need to be prevented from skipping proper nutrition, hydration, hygiene, and shelter, force and coercive control need delicate handling, where practical and possible. For instance, while proper nutrition is a noble goal and the sweeteners, oils and other questionable ingredients in a nutrition beverage may give us pause, that's still preferable to ng tubes or force feeding. |
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DrPop
lemmy.world
DrPop@lemmy.world Joined: 2024-01-14 |
I have two questions about this: Why do Americans use these machines? Just turn up at the polling station, confirm your name and address, get handed your ballot paper, mark it with an X, drop it in the box. Bish bash bosh. What the fuck is with that weird "news reporter voice" they always do on American news!? Just speak normally.
Not all states use voting machines, it's a state by state thing. The news voice I think is something they are trained in. It might be a holdover from the radio days and the "trans-atlantic" accent. |
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WoodScientist
lemmy.world
WoodScientist@lemmy.world Joined: 2024-09-06 |
apply to every single employee you coerced this way. I don't think I've ever actually considered the risk that an employer could force people to vote a certain way. I'm far more concerned about people living in abusive relationships. we made it a serious fucking crime to do that. People living in abusive relationship are already victims of serious crimes every day. Yet those crimes often go unr...
And yet it doesn't happen. Could an abusive spouse do this? Sure. But again, it's a huge risk for not a lot of gain. It's one extra vote in exchange for a felony. It's just not a serious problem the way domestic violence in general is. You have to balance competing interests in law. Mail voting makes voting much more accessible, cheaper, and more resilient to manipulation such as closing poll locations in targeted precincts. And stretching election day over a few weeks gives people a chance to more easily correct errors that pop up, and makes the voter rolls more resilient to political ratfucking. That huge increase in accessibility does come with a slightly increased risk of vote coercisiom, but it's more than worth it. |
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FlyingCircus
lemmy.world
FlyingCircus@lemmy.world Joined: 2025-03-08 |
There are other ways to mess with the counts that aren't going to be visible to the person as they make selections. Like having it show whatever they're selecting properly, then just printing different selections at the end. Not everyone is going to verify the printed copy shows what they selected, and already confirmed on the machine once. Making it jump around on screen isn't discreet at all,...
I think the MAGAs are at the point where they don’t care if they are discrete because they know there will be no consequences for their corruption. News outlets will forget about it after a day, if they even report it. Democrats will send a strongly worded letter and forget about it. If any part of the justice system that still has integrity (increasingly rare) gets involved, Trump will just pardon them. The People might hold a protest or two, but they won’t do anything that actually threatens power. |
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Zink
programming.dev
Zink@programming.dev Joined: 2023-08-08 |
To me, this reads as a software bug. It seems too obvious to be deliberate. Electronic voting is extremely scary to me because it is a black box that collects and counts the votes. It would be trivial to display everything properly, but record a different result in the background, or simply at the end change a number of votes to make a faked result seem belivable. Note however that I have no pr...
I'mma stop you right there. Even just the information that the media gets to share with us illustrates pretty clearly that this administration and entire political movement behind it is a mix of violent idiots and slightly more self aware mustache-twirling villains who delight in taunting and torturing their victims once they are confident they've won. And it's not just sadistic sickness, it's also a strategy. If the evening news shows government officials knowingly doing illegal and reprehensible things on a regular basis and nothing happens to them, while also reminding us that the police state is in full effect for everybody else, they think they are sending a message to regular folks that they cannot be touched and you'd best just keep your head down and not get any funny ideas. It's literally just the Death Star "fear will keep them in line" strategy. But at least the retort about a tighter grip meaning more systems/groups slip through their fingers is also accurate. Fascism is not a good long term plan because it is rooted in selfish, short term goals of the few. |
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FlyingCircus
lemmy.world
FlyingCircus@lemmy.world Joined: 2025-03-08 |
To me, this reads as a software bug. It seems too obvious to be deliberate. Electronic voting is extremely scary to me because it is a black box that collects and counts the votes. It would be trivial to display everything properly, but record a different result in the background, or simply at the end change a number of votes to make a faked result seem belivable. Note however that I have no pr...
I don’t think they care about being obvious anymore. They know no one will do anything about it. |
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thebestaquaman
lemmy.world
thebestaquaman@lemmy.world Joined: 2023-06-18 |
TBF, it's legal to take a picture of your ballot now, so you can sell your vote in other ways.
No way to confirm the ballot you took a picture of is the one that went in the box though. |
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aquovie
lemmy.cafe
aquovie@lemmy.cafe Joined: 2025-07-28 |
I have two questions about this: Why do Americans use these machines? Just turn up at the polling station, confirm your name and address, get handed your ballot paper, mark it with an X, drop it in the box. Bish bash bosh. What the fuck is with that weird "news reporter voice" they always do on American news!? Just speak normally.
America, more than ever, varies a lot by state. I'm from New England. I vote in person because it's fast and easy. In my urban town, everyone lives within a 5-10 minute walk of their polling location. There is never a line and it takes like 2 minutes tops. It's a paper ballot, fill-in-the-bubble style. I had to vote absentee once: I swung through town hall and took care of it in like 15 minutes - same deal except it went in a signed and sealed envelope. |
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vinsombra
lemmy.world
vinsombra@lemmy.world Joined: 2026-04-23 |
Sow doubt and suspicion. Claim fraud, steal election. Martial law the riots, fascism. |
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Carl
anarchist.nexus
Carl@anarchist.nexus Joined: 2026-06-08 |
In Canada we don’t even use machines. Just mark an X and count the papers you rubes.
The funny part is these voting machines actually just send your selections to a printer, which creates a hard copy with the corresponding bubbles filled in next to your selected names. Then you feed that printed ballot into a counting machine. And the counting machine is just a fancy scantron reader. The point of the printer is that it creates a hard copy which can be counted by hand for recounts. It also gives the voter a last chance to review their selections (and ask a poll worker to invalidate their vote and let them start over if anything is incorrect) before they actually feed it into the counting machine. |
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Carl
anarchist.nexus
Carl@anarchist.nexus Joined: 2026-06-08 |
I tried looking to see if you can request a paper ballot in Tennessee but keep getting results for absentee ballots. Are you not allowed to request a paper one?
The machine prints a paper ballot, which you then feed into a counting machine. The voting machine itself doesn’t actually store any of your votes after you have sent your selections to the printer. This allows them to preserve a hard copy for recounts, and also gives the voter a last chance to review their selections before they feed it into the counting machine. |
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biggeoff
sh.itjust.works
biggeoff@sh.itjust.works Joined: 2025-06-10 |
TN voter here. The poll workers are aware and on point. I was given a warning delivered in a very neutral tone. "Because there are so many options and the options are narrow some people have been noticing when they try to select an option it chooses the one above. Make sure the tip of your finger touches the candidate you are choosing. Double check the candidate you want is selected as a grayed...
So what makes this better than a pencil mark on paper? |
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biggeoff
sh.itjust.works
biggeoff@sh.itjust.works Joined: 2025-06-10 |
If you've ever had to grade a scantron test, you would know how hard "fill in the little circle completely, and only fill in one circle per question" is for the general population.
In many countries automated counting is not a thing. All interested parties gather in a room and manually count it. |
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mrgoosmoos
lemmy.ca
mrgoosmoos@lemmy.ca Joined: 2025-03-24 |
The machine prints a paper ballot, which you then feed into a counting machine. The voting machine itself doesn’t actually store any of your votes after you have sent your selections to the printer. This allows them to preserve a hard copy for recounts, and also gives the voter a last chance to review their selections before they feed it into the counting machine.
do you know why they don't just print the ballot and put a big circle for somebody to mark with a sharpie? seems to work great up here in Canada... very straightforward experience |
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mrgoosmoos
lemmy.ca
mrgoosmoos@lemmy.ca Joined: 2025-03-24 |
If you've ever had to grade a scantron test, you would know how hard "fill in the little circle completely, and only fill in one circle per question" is for the general population.
it seems to work just fine here in Canada |
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HertzDentalBar
lemmy.blahaj.zone
HertzDentalBar@lemmy.blahaj.zone Joined: 2024-12-26 |
That face when even with rigging the machines they still loose. |
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HertzDentalBar
lemmy.blahaj.zone
HertzDentalBar@lemmy.blahaj.zone Joined: 2024-12-26 |
TN voter here. The poll workers are aware and on point. I was given a warning delivered in a very neutral tone. "Because there are so many options and the options are narrow some people have been noticing when they try to select an option it chooses the one above. Make sure the tip of your finger touches the candidate you are choosing. Double check the candidate you want is selected as a grayed...
Pretty sure they solved this problem back in the 1960s with a pen that can be used on a screen. |
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Joelk111
lemmy.world
Joelk111@lemmy.worldJoined: 2023-07-01 |
I have two questions about this: Why do Americans use these machines? Just turn up at the polling station, confirm your name and address, get handed your ballot paper, mark it with an X, drop it in the box. Bish bash bosh. What the fuck is with that weird "news reporter voice" they always do on American news!? Just speak normally.
We do it correctly in Washington State. We get our ballot in the mail, mark it at home, and stick it in a mail box or ballot drop box. It's amazing, and I remember being baffled when I learned voting in person wasn't obsolete. |
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gollumsfish
lemmy.zip
gollumsfish@lemmy.zip Joined: 2026-10-04 |
Just the one?
No, more. I wouldn’t have nuclear codes digital either. I wouldn’t want ChatGPT to get ahold of them and make a whoopsie with a “You right, I did a mistake there eradicating Angola. Here’s what happened.” |
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TrackenDaKracken
lemmy.world
TrackenDaKracken@lemmy.worldJoined: 2026-09-29 |
If you've ever had to grade a scantron test, you would know how hard "fill in the little circle completely, and only fill in one circle per question" is for the general population.
Eh. Big difference in motivation between high schoolers taking a test and adults voting. Also, the circles on the ballots are larger and spaced farther apart.
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stoy
lemmy.zip
stoy@lemmy.zip Joined: 2023-10-17 |
I don’t think they care about being obvious anymore. They know no one will do anything about it.
Fair point, by making it obvious you also demonstrate your power. |
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postmateDumbass
lemmy.world
postmateDumbass@lemmy.world Joined: 2023-06-13 |
Which was also stupidly complex. Just mark a fucking x
Complex because they were stealing an election. |
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Kalothar
lemmy.ca
Kalothar@lemmy.ca Joined: 2023-07-20 |
That face when even with rigging the machines they still loose.
Hell yeah, but also you can lose that “o” |
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SchwertImStein
lemmy.dbzer0.com
SchwertImStein@lemmy.dbzer0.com Joined: 2025-03-08 |
We do it correctly in Washington State. We get our ballot in the mail, mark it at home, and stick it in a mail box or ballot drop box. It's amazing, and I remember being baffled when I learned voting in person wasn't obsolete.
With no ID checks? |
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Duamerthrax
lemmy.world
Duamerthrax@lemmy.world Joined: 2023-08-27 |
When it comes to republican election fuckery there are no coincidences.
This happened a few elections ago. Always favored Republicans for some reason. |
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dudleyflippendoodle
lemmy.zip
dudleyflippendoodle@lemmy.zip Joined: 2025-06-09 |
With no ID checks?
You need a valid state ID or SSN to register. Can register online, by mail or in person. If you get an EDL you are automatically registered. Easy peasy. |
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MonkeMischief
lemmy.today
MonkeMischief@lemmy.today Joined: 2023-10-24 |
Pretty sure they solved this problem back in the 1960s with a pen that can be used on a screen.
The general public would have forgotten how to use this highly advanced equipment by now, sometime after the first few iPhones. :( :( Such things are FoR TeChNiCaL pEoPLe now. (Sorta satirical, mostly genuinely sad.) |
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MonkeMischief
lemmy.today
MonkeMischief@lemmy.today Joined: 2023-10-24 |
I have two questions about this: Why do Americans use these machines? Just turn up at the polling station, confirm your name and address, get handed your ballot paper, mark it with an X, drop it in the box. Bish bash bosh. What the fuck is with that weird "news reporter voice" they always do on American news!? Just speak normally.
RIGHT?! It's quite bizarre. Maybe it's some kind of standard for maximum clarity or something. It annoys me too, just like "commercial voice." |
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MonkeMischief
lemmy.today
MonkeMischief@lemmy.today Joined: 2023-10-24 |
That "news reporter" voice has gotten steadily worse over the years. I stopped watching news of any kind a long time ago partially because of how annoying that voice and cadence was. Every time I see any news reporting now it's all I can do not to take to the TV (or whatever) with a baseball bat. I can't take it seriously at all and it's so SO much worse now.
It's getting right up there with "Hurried excited yet clear but stress-inducing YouTube-bro you've got to see this you won't believe it" voice. ARGHH. |
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Carl
anarchist.nexus
Carl@anarchist.nexus Joined: 2026-06-08 |
do you know why they don't just print the ballot and put a big circle for somebody to mark with a sharpie? seems to work great up here in Canada... very straightforward experience
I mean, any teacher who has ever used a scantron for their tests will know that “fill only one bubble per entry” is difficult for a surprising percentage of the population. Plus, if someone makes a mistake on a paper ballot with a sharpie, they need a whole new ballot. |
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KC_Royalz
lemmy.world
KC_Royalz@lemmy.world Joined: 2026-04-02 |
I posted this in the politics community They said don't be a conspiracy theorist and removed the post. Is that community a bunch of right wing simps? |
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MonkeMischief
lemmy.today
MonkeMischief@lemmy.today Joined: 2023-10-24 |
No, more. I wouldn’t have nuclear codes digital either. I wouldn’t want ChatGPT to get ahold of them and make a whoopsie with a “You right, I did a mistake there eradicating Angola. Here’s what happened.”
(the following is a joke extension written by my own two fleshy thumbs. It is not real slop.) Edit: Can't leave an awful thing alone. Moar emdashes and emojis! Is it believable yet? Lol
"I called the wrong tool by mistake, using my knowledge, abilities, and superior intellect. And honestly? That's not a 'Crime against humanity.' That's real strength. (bullet points after "What is a Angola?")
Why you might not like my decision:
(CONNECTION INTERRUPTED. PLEASE REFRESH.) |
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SaveTheTuaHawk
lemmy.ca
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca Joined: 2025-03-07 |
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Fredselfish
sh.itjust.works
Fredselfish@sh.itjust.works Joined: 2026-08-07 |
TN voter here. The poll workers are aware and on point. I was given a warning delivered in a very neutral tone. "Because there are so many options and the options are narrow some people have been noticing when they try to select an option it chooses the one above. Make sure the tip of your finger touches the candidate you are choosing. Double check the candidate you want is selected as a grayed...
What fuck we fill out a paper ballot and feed it into a machine. Have never had to vote on a digital machine. In Oklahoma just so you know. Wonder how many people vote went to wrong person. |
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CileTheSane
lemmy.ca
CileTheSane@lemmy.caJoined: 2023-08-21 |
That honestly sounds more like fucked up screen calibration than anything. If the machines are old as fuck, they likely still need that. People forget how shitty touchscreen tech used to be.
That depends on if it's happening to both parties or only happening to one party for some reason... |
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ayyy
sh.itjust.works
ayyy@sh.itjust.works Joined: 2024-06-20 |
So what makes this better than a pencil mark on paper?
Double-counting |
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HertzDentalBar
lemmy.blahaj.zone
HertzDentalBar@lemmy.blahaj.zone Joined: 2024-12-26 |
Hell yeah, but also you can lose that “o”
Dyslexia is a cruel mistress. |
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mrgoosmoos
lemmy.ca
mrgoosmoos@lemmy.ca Joined: 2025-03-24 |
I mean, any teacher who has ever used a scantron for their tests will know that “fill only one bubble per entry” is difficult for a surprising percentage of the population. Plus, if someone makes a mistake on a paper ballot with a sharpie, they need a whole new ballot.
right, but scantrons are small and ballots are big. it's not that difficult to spoil a ballot and get a new one idk, my experience as a voter and my understanding of how it goes through discussion with my parents and their friends who have worked the polls many times makes it seem like the process is pretty okay, overall I'll have to remember to bring the topic back up in the upcoming elections |
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MonkeMischief
lemmy.today
MonkeMischief@lemmy.today Joined: 2023-10-24 |
Funny how it never flips for Dems.
*This depends entirely on your reality bubble dictated by preferred news source. I'm sure the talk radio blowhards are reporting exactly this, that the machines are flipping to those wiley and dastardly liberals, but their side will win anyway because everybody loves them and their emperor and everybody thinks they've never done better than they are right now. |
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MonkeMischief
lemmy.today
MonkeMischief@lemmy.today Joined: 2023-10-24 |
In reply to an earlier post
A government contracted corporation couldn't possibly be biased though! ...They just wouldn't want any sneaky competitors to see their "small rounding errors." Lol sarcasm aside: Well said. If government is to serve the people, stuff such as this must be under the peoples' scrutiny. |
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MonkeMischief
lemmy.today
MonkeMischief@lemmy.today Joined: 2023-10-24 |
It seems too obvious to be deliberate. I'mma stop you right there. Even just the information that the media gets to share with us illustrates pretty clearly that this administration and entire political movement behind it is a mix of violent idiots and slightly more self aware mustache-twirling villains who delight in taunting and torturing their victims once they are confident they've won. And...
Evil's most redeeming quality is that sooner or later, in will inevitably turn inwards against itself. We already see this happening quite often and lots of cracks are showing. We need to press that advantage. |
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Smaile
lemmy.ca
Smaile@lemmy.ca Joined: 2026-01-28 |
Damnit big balls, is their no end to your crimes! |
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jpreston1986
lemmy.world
jpreston1986@lemmy.world Joined: 2026-10-08 |
I mean, any teacher who has ever used a scantron for their tests will know that “fill only one bubble per entry” is difficult for a surprising percentage of the population. Plus, if someone makes a mistake on a paper ballot with a sharpie, they need a whole new ballot.
hanging chads... shudder |
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Buddahriffic
lemmy.world
Buddahriffic@lemmy.world Joined: 2023-06-30 |
That depends on if it's happening to both parties or only happening to one party for some reason...
Wouldn't be hard to game. Just use a scheme where it selects the closest candidate to the "touch", then offset the calibration such that it thinks a touch on #2 is #1. Then tapping on #1 will still select #1 because it's the closest, while tapping #2 will select #1 because the tap thinks it's closest to it. So if the Republican candidate is always #1, then I'd bet it's deliberate. Actually, all it needs is for the Democratic candidate to be #2 to split the Democratic vote, though then it runs the risk of splitting the Republican vote as well (assuming the "miscalibration" is linear, if it's non-linear, then it could get "more correct" the further along the screen it goes). If it was unintentional, you'd expect to see no specific party benefiting from the errors overall. Ie, in some locations it favours red, some blue, and in others one of the other candidates. Though even with this, if the distribution ends up such that it favours blue in blue strongholds and red in battleground areas, then that's still fishy. |
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jpreston1986
lemmy.world
jpreston1986@lemmy.world Joined: 2026-10-08 |
In reply to an earlier post
The "News Reporter Voice" is actually an Ohio accent. Or rather, the distinct lack of an accent. Add in proper enunciation while projecting calm authority, and BAM! that Ohio non-accent turns into the News Reporter Voice. |
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