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non violence does not exist
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A404 lemmy.dbzer0.com A404@lemmy.dbzer0.com
Joined: 2026-04-11
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Walters, Fern bookwyr.me waltersf@bookwyr.me
Joined: 2026-08-23
#2 · (edited) Quote Reply

Yet a liberal still demands non violence as means to resist the violent state.

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ChonkyOwlbear lemmy.world ChonkyOwlbear@lemmy.world
Joined: 2023-06-24
#3 · Quote Reply

Yet a liberal still demands non violence as means to resist the violent state.

If nonviolence doesn't exist, that doesn't automatically mean being as violent as possible is always the best tactic.

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Walters, Fern bookwyr.me waltersf@bookwyr.me
Joined: 2026-08-23
#4 · (edited) Quote Reply

If nonviolence doesn't exist, that doesn't automatically mean being as violent as possible is always the best tactic.

yikes, they are still showing up.

In bona fide, I’ll pressume you read the essay.
How should we respond to ICE murder, abductions, raids, and now polling place vigilantism then?

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ChonkyOwlbear lemmy.world ChonkyOwlbear@lemmy.world
Joined: 2023-06-24
#5 · Quote Reply

yikes, they are still showing up. In bona fide, I’ll pressume you read the essay. How should we respond to ICE murder, abductions, raids, and now polling place vigilantism then?

Let's do a little thought experiment. A car full of ICE agents pull up and start trying to arrest a suspected undocumented immigrant. A bystander responds by whipping out an AR and killing all the ICE agents in rapid succession. It's a lovely thought, but what would be the repercussions?

Sure, the undocumented immigrant would get away. The shooter's life is over though. The state would come down so hard that they would never have a place to hide. It goes beyond that though. How would ICE change their tactics then? Would they be quicker to shoot bystanders? You bet. The government would turn those ICE agents into martyrs and anyone who dared step up to speak for victims of ICE into terrorists. They are looking for an excuse to do this.

Another way of approaching this scenario is to whip out your phone instead of a gun. Start recording. Yell for help and for other people to record. Get the name of the victim so their family and a lawyer can be contacted for them. Get a crowd gathering. Make ICE panic. Make them lose control of the situation. They will always be able to summon more lethal force, but we have the numbers. When they are overwhelmed they usually retreat.

Organize, obstruct, sabotage, and broadcast their violence to the public. They are fucking with voting because they are afraid of losing control of power. They still think voting matters and we should act accordingly. The worse we can make the public hate them, the less power they can hold onto.

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Walters, Fern bookwyr.me waltersf@bookwyr.me
Joined: 2026-08-23
#6 · Quote Reply

Let's do a little thought experiment. A car full of ICE agents pull up and start trying to arrest a suspected undocumented immigrant. A bystander responds by whipping out an AR and killing all the ICE agents in rapid succession. It's a lovely thought, but what would be the repercussions? Sure, the undocumented immigrant would get away. The shooter's life is over though. The state would come dow...

suspected undocumented immigrant.

Already a false premise.

A bystander

It should be several. Every American should be armed and opposing Nazism.

what would be the repercussions?

None, as IRL Nazis faced none.

The state would come down so hard that they would never have a place to hide.

This is admitting your state is Nazi, and that they’ll persecute you.

They are looking for an excuse to do this.

Please stop spreading this lie. ICE & cops are killing 3 Americans per day. They are already acting as if we will oppose with force they are already applying.

When they are overwhelmed they usually retreat.

And come right back when we “quiet down.” The tactic of yelping at leopards still get fawn killed. Many fawns are still being killed.

Organize, obstruct, sabotage, and broadcast their violence to the public.

I believe we have very vastly definitions on how to achieve these, anti-fascist-cally. Historically, Nazis were obstructed via trenches, explosives, barbs, traps, and riffles. Sabotage still means sending Nazis to space. But yes, an antifa network response organisation should be monitoring and reporting what ICE is doing.

They are fucking with voting because they are afraid of losing control of power.

Isn't every authoritarian government the same though?

They still think voting matters and we should act accordingly

The authoritarian government, or electoralists? Because the former does, for keeping the population distracted. The latter does for class treachery.

The worse we can make the public hate them, the less power they can hold onto.

This is the second lie I need you to cease. The public already hates the entire system. The question is if they are ready to oppose the government that hates them. They already have plenty of power: press, monopolies, money, weapons, ammunition, etc.. But how many are willing to Ishikawa Goemon/Robbin Hood the weapon vaults into the hands of the disenfranchised people?

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0xDREADBEEF lemmy.dbzer0.com dreadbeef@lemmy.dbzer0.com
Joined: 2024-12-18
#7 · Quote Reply

Let's do a little thought experiment. A car full of ICE agents pull up and start trying to arrest a suspected undocumented immigrant. A bystander responds by whipping out an AR and killing all the ICE agents in rapid succession. It's a lovely thought, but what would be the repercussions? Sure, the undocumented immigrant would get away. The shooter's life is over though. The state would come dow...

What if the entire town was armed and stood between ICE and the target? You could watch from afar and cheer them on

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ChonkyOwlbear lemmy.world ChonkyOwlbear@lemmy.world
Joined: 2023-06-24
#8 · Quote Reply

suspected undocumented immigrant. Already a false premise. A bystander It should be several. Every American should be armed and opposing Nazism. what would be the repercussions? None, as IRL Nazis faced none. The state would come down so hard that they would never have a place to hide. This is admitting your state is Nazi, and that they’ll persecute you. They are looking for an excuse to do thi...

This is admitting your state is Nazi, and that [they’ll persecute you]

Yeah, obviously the current leadership is fascist. No argument here.

Please stop spreading this lie. ICE & cops are killing 3 Americans per day. They are already acting as if we will oppose with force they are already applying.

Cops are doing most of the killing there. ICE deaths are in double digits for the year which is awful still but far from 3 per day. Cops killing people is a huge problem but not what we are talking about here.

Historically, Nazis were obstructed via trenches, explosives, barbs, traps, and riffles.

Historically the Nazis were fought in a foreign country. Fighting them here means a civil war with about a third of the country siding with the Nazis. The death and suffering would be immense. I look at this as a last resort and hope that we can remove them from power in other ways.

The public already hates the entire system.

It's about WHO takes the blame for that system. I understand that getting rid of the system as a whole is probably your goal, but at the very least getting the current Republicans out of power would move you a little closer to your goal.

But how many are willing to Ishikawa Goemon/Robbin Hood the weapon vaults into the hands of the disenfranchised people?

There are already enough arms in civilian hands to equip every able bodied adult with a pistol and longarm. Heavyier weapons are of limited use without the supply lines to keep them operational and the knowledge to operate them ( I sure as hell don't know how to drive a tank or a jet).

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ChonkyOwlbear lemmy.world ChonkyOwlbear@lemmy.world
Joined: 2023-06-24
#9 · Quote Reply

What if the entire town was armed and stood between ICE and the target? You could watch from afar and cheer them on

The sad part is in an average town a third of the people would arm up and stand beside ICE.

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A404 lemmy.dbzer0.com A404@lemmy.dbzer0.com
Joined: 2026-04-11
#10 · (edited) Quote Reply

Let's do a little thought experiment. A car full of ICE agents pull up and start trying to arrest a suspected undocumented immigrant. A bystander responds by whipping out an AR and killing all the ICE agents in rapid succession. It's a lovely thought, but what would be the repercussions? Sure, the undocumented immigrant would get away. The shooter's life is over though. The state would come dow...

If you want to avoid escalating to a gunfight, there's always the option to swarm them.

Edit: Also no, the cops do not need an excuse to escalate to violence. If they really wanted to, they could just stage a riot like they do it in Europe.

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Walters, Fern bookwyr.me waltersf@bookwyr.me
Joined: 2026-08-23
#11 · Quote Reply

This is admitting your state is Nazi, and that [they’ll persecute you] Yeah, obviously the current leadership is fascist. No argument here. Please stop spreading this lie. ICE & cops are killing 3 Americans per day. They are already acting as if we will oppose with force they are already applying. Cops are doing most of the killing there. ICE deaths are in double digits for the year which i...

I look at this as a last resort and hope that we can remove them from power in other ways.

How. Your yelping tactic has already proven itself ineffective in ending your fascist government. If ⅓ are nazis, it shouldn't be your last resort, but your primary response, as you already stated, you're in a nazi government. You're already in civil war, and you're losing.

WHO takes the blame for that system

Liberalism espouse the Republican for the causes of evil they ignore. So yeah, if you don't feel responsible for holding both accountable, then you're the liberal vanguard that rose Stalin to power.

There are already enough arms in civilian hands to equip every able bodied adult with a pistol and longarm.

I am missing mines. Where do I acquire these anti drone arms I read so much about?

I sure as hell don’t know how to drive a tank or a jet

And there in lies your defeat. Not because you don't know how to operate heavy arms, but because you no longer practice anti heavy tactics to keep them disabled enough for necessary insurrection. Tanks are as simple as cranes. Jets need specific fuels to stay airborne.

Glad although the narrative is that liberals are aware they are Nazis, and that they don't have to move a muscle to get their pies.

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0xDREADBEEF lemmy.dbzer0.com dreadbeef@lemmy.dbzer0.com
Joined: 2024-12-18
#12 · Quote Reply

The sad part is in an average town a third of the people would arm up and stand beside ICE.

they lack class consciousness

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