You don't know me.

I was thinking about the airport stuff. Even that isn't what it may seem. For the upper middle class it is an inconvenience. But those below that who either fly for work, or to see family when they can afford it, it is much more than an inconvenience. So even that hits the "worker" harder.

But... who watches the news really. Not the worker who is working multiple jobs to pay the bills. And really, how does the gov shutdown hurt them. They have ensured that the things they most care about aren't affected. Like air force one isn't affected. All the upper level government officials are on private or government owned jets and by passing normal security.
After this shut down, they will probably add tsa to the always gets paid anyway list.

I haven't figured out if a general strike would really bother them either. After it was done, they could probably have layoffs "because of the economic impact of the strike" and get rid of people they felt were organizers. Plus people who are old or cost too much and all that. And of course a general strike would be nearly impossible to make happen. There are of course laws against union leadership backing such a thing. So they have taken the most likely organizers out of the process.

Seems a no win scenario.

Just because the poster doesn't take action, doesn't mean they are wrong.

we've seen no kings 1 & 2 change diddly squat, so obviously we'll do the same thing a third time with the high hopes that nothing will change too!

Guy that is attending the useless no kings protest

You want actual change? Look at Europe on how to protest. I'm sorry for you Americans, but you got yourself in this, you gotta dig yourself out. Trump will NOT care about the o kings protest, and it'll fade from the news within two days tops. It. Is. Not. Enough.

Protest 24/7 for months on end until the fucker is gone

Have strikes everywhere, indeed, because that it the only way you'll get his attention and get this administration to understand that it's over

Narrator: they aren't

Just pointing out, a general strike is not only self-inflicted. Per day it would cost the government far more than what a government shutdown does. We're talking about a factor of 70.

A government shutdown costs are an estimated 500 millions a day.

If we only shave of half of the daily GDP due to a general strike, we are talking about 38 billion.

You are right in saying it would hurt you as well, but a general strike is a lot more effective.

Edit: Btw, Americans daily shopping contributes only about a third of daily gdp.

Why does a general strike have to be organized? All folks have to do is stop buying things or spending money as much as possible. The fucking country would grind to a halt. The amount of shit that we buy that we dont need is staggering... Probably daily you buy something (likely multiple things) that you dont need. And here'a the thing: you have to be ready to suffer. No change will come to us if we continue to prioritize comfort and convenience.

And if you have to go to work, do the bare minimum to stay employed. Some may say to actively sabotage, but i wouldnt say that or think it, so you should not actively sabotage the company you work at.

A general strike for one-day is silly. Any company can weather one day.

That number is ridiculous on the face of it. Perhaps the POTENTIAL is there, but the reality is that when people don't shop for a day, they just buy what they need the day before or after, so that number isn't real.

As for workplace impact, there's a bit, but just like shopping, whatever work needs to be done will be done after or before, and if you don't, you'll be fired. American workers have literally no job security protections. After a one day general strike, many Americans would find that they are the victims of a permanent Employer Strike. That's something that European workers simply don't understand. You won't get fired for a strike, but we DEFINITELY will. Many, many employers will fire EVERY worker who doesn't show up on strike day.

And this isn't all about the MONEY anyway, that's a particularly Capitalistic perspective. The current shutdown, which isn't even a full shutdown, is making them crazy, all day, every day. They are constantly asked about it by journalists, it is on every single news broadcast, and it clearly focuses the entire nation, and more importantly, the MAGA Government, on the problem. This shutdown isn't about money, it's about morality, and MAGA has a very difficult time defending themselves on the morality front.

But... who watches the news really

One of the dumbest statements ever. TV media runs news programs every morning, noon, and night. Entire stations are devoted to it, as are many websites, radio stations, publications, books, etc. clearly, a LOT of people are following the news. If that's your opening premise, you've already lost the debate.

Why does a general strike have to be organized?

Because we have like, 350 million people here, and if it's not organized, you just have a tiny insignificant percentage buying less and the economy doesn't even notice.

If "buy less stuff" was all it took, well... I've been doing that for years, so why isn't the problem solved yet? It's because the vast majority of people aren't. It needs an organized effort to get the word out, and to make people who otherwise wouldn't engage understand the potential impact, and how to realize that.

There's also the problem where a prolonged general strike would mean a huge number of people would lose their health care and wouldn't be able to pay rent or buy food and that's simply not sustainable. I'm not sure how to overcome that problem, and so far nobody else seems to, either.

We can agree to disagree. Just pointing out the facts.

I disagree about it being permissable. If anything it makes you a hypocrite and undermines the appearance of intelligence and empathy, alike. The complaint is also misguided and simply wrong. Saying nothing will change is absurd. Things are already changing. These rallies raise awareness for everyone. You can't have a general strike until you get everyone to agree to it.

C'mon, it doesn't hit the average worker NEARLY as much as those with money, that's just common sense. It widely disproportionately hurts the middle rich. The truly wealthy have their own planes. It's the UPPER MANAGEMENT Class that gets hit, the bosses and C-Suite Sociopaths. Fuck them, let them stand in line at the airport while the rest of us relax at home. We'll either drive, or contact the other relatives by Facetime. That's what we all usually do, anyway.

This isn't the year for a visit. Don't like missing your grandchildren, Grandma? Maybe you should stop voting MAGA.

It's not even about how you protest, it's about what you use protests for. You can have the best protest ever, longest strike imaginable, whatever. If you don't have the organisation to have coherent changes and then act upon them, nothing matters. No kings, huh? What if by a stroke of magic, Trump gets scared of your rally and tries to appease the public or whatever. What's the terms? No kings. Well, he's not a king, he's the president. Problem solved, continue as you were.

You are not agreeing to disagree.

You are calling them a liar.

I'm not. Just disagreeing with their take. Calm down.

It’s very easy to say but you need to understand there are no labor protections in the US. Any protest during work hours result in termination.

I'm not going to be first in line to start doing something that actually fucking matters, but you bet your ass I'll be third.

I wouldn't say they're calling me a liar, and they're not even wrong, it's just that the employment environment in Europe that makes General Strikes successful is far different than in America. They generally can't be fired for any reason at all. Unions are common, and powerful, even in lower level jobs like retail, and even the governments are worker friendly.

That's the exact opposite where any worker can be fired literally on a whim. Your boss hates your socks that day? After 20 years of loyal work, you're fired, get out. Seriously, that's totally legal.

OTOH, Europeans don't have a mechanism where they can literally shut down the government they hate. We do, and it works every time (if our elected representives have have a backbone).

What works over there, doesn't work here, and vice-versa. Criticizing Americans for not doing a General Strike is just as dumb as criticizing Europeans for not doing a Government Shutdown. We're going to use the tools that work in our specific Political-Economic Environments. Doesn't that make sense?

Who cares what gets covered in the European media?

I'm just telling you, because ->I<- am from Europe and because ->I<- have not heard about any government shutdown plans, only about the "No king" stuff... I can only tell you about what I observe. I don't watch American media. I thought, that was obvious.

You are GREATLY underestimating how Sociopathic MAGA is as a fundamental characteristic. They will only respond when THEY feel the pain.

We have far right AfD here... One of them was recorded saying that it's good good that our country is doing bad in the short run, so they can take power in the long run. We are all living through the idiotic revolution and it's unfortunately an international thing.

Your wallet is your strongest voice in the eyes of this administration. Think carefully about where you spend your hard earned money.

A single day of avoiding Walmart and Amazon is not meaningful if you give them your money tomorrow. Find local businesses that deserve your money and spend your money with them instead.

Buy less and buy better quality items that last longer. Reduce consumerism and give homemade gifts or experiences instead of more junk nobody needs. Use lending libraries, swap groups, and other methods to reduce your contribution to the economy, which is frankly the only thing the American government really is interested in.

And hats off to the person who successfully organizes a general strike. I’m cheering you on from Canada.

no kings has no leverage and no power and no stamina and no guts. are the police attacking them in the streets? i personaly see these kind of protests as controlled off gassing. you have a large amount of people who would under other circumstances be pushed into actual action, thinking they make a difference doing this, allowing the system to functionally ignore them.

without the media on your side these protests do not work. and the media is captured, and neither side wants to see this stop

Then get fired, all of you.

A company can't fire all their employees, just go all protest

Exactly my point. You are telling us to do something, because your media isn't telling you that we ARE doing something, it's just something that Europeans have no experience with. So your media shows it from your perspective, and you think we're doing nothing.

I'm trying to explain to you, and the many, many other Europeans calling us stupid for not having a General Strike without understanding that 1) It won't work in America, and 2) We are already doing something that is unique to America, and is a past proven winner in getting the government to respond.

Thanks. At the end of the day I'm on your side and want the same thing, which is not having fascists at the helm of the United States. If that goal is achieved in a different way than I (or Europeans) would have done, that's okey.

Good luck and fortitude in your fight for democracy.

i don’t agree at all. the reason is that the people who go to these will argue that they are making a difference and fight against what comes next.

these are not even having the police interfere so you know no one cares at all. school children have a walk out criticizing israel? police show up with chemical weapons and shoots people point blank with less the lethal rounds. go to a no kings and police is directing traffic.

no these protests are a distraction to make people think that nothing more has to be done, and they did their part.

and then on tv the largest mass protest in history is a foot note to trumps birthday party. so no.

except the ones who have traditionally fought against the right to bear arms is the same people protesting. they need to be armed, and they need to protest with their arms, same reason a government will parade with their weapons

Yeah that's the pot calling the kettle black. Infighting between groups who manage to effect 0 change.

And are you actively organizing to change that? Or are you just providing an example of OP?

many other Europeans calling us stupid

I'm not calling you stupid btw. I'm calling those stupid who vote against their interests without realizing it.

something that Europeans have no experience with

I think, the the newspapers in Europa are capable to understand basic US politics without having to experience that MAGA shitshow themselves and without having the same laws.

Anyways... Good luck stopping the orange manic, however you do it!

Sure, but do you see the hypocrisy in pointing one how little one form of resistance helps while participating in one that helps even less?

Remember, if your organization is big enough to organize a general strike, the feds are there and watching. Watch your back

recall that the FBI infiltrated the civil rights movement and more even before we had a police state empowered by the Patriot Act surveillance and AI data collection.

I have zero proof, but I suspect that they are actively disrupting all attempts at organization. This is based on the history of CIA and FBI; we never know what they are doing currently, we only know a tiny bit of what they have done in the past.

Maybe I'm paranoid.

Why is it always a general strike? Why not a rent/mortgage strike?

Calm down? We're gunna circle back around to that.

But in what world is half of a percent of 500m a day equal to 38 billion? So not only are you incorrect in your turn of phrases, but you also don't understand math.

And I was calm, just pointing out that the phrase you used was incorrect. You so casually dropping that phrase is pretty fucking misogynistic, it really reads like a guy talking down to a woman. You should really work on that about yourself.

Edit: you down voting this means it affected you in some way. I hope you reflect on that fact.

Yes, let's look at Europe.

The USA is comparable to all of the EU in size, much larger than France, UK, Germany, etc. combined.

Has all of the EU ever been able to organize? France is smaller than California, one US state out of 50.

I'm sorry for you Europeans, but why do you keep supporting and enabling the USA? You continue to finance the very war machine that oppresses you (and us). Stop buying US products and stop using the US Dollar for international trade.

Go on strike yourselves and boycott, you are the experts eh? But you won't bother, you will continue to provide our government with billions while saying "pity that"... and then complain when the USAs boot is on your neck.

Re people from the USA... MLK and peace only did so much. We need less peaceful MLK protest and more Black Panthers-style protesting. Peaceful protests are worthless alone

Yes. I'm a member of a number of local mutual aid orgs and other groups that I started working more closely with after my home state was invaded by ICE.

No kings protests get media attention. How are your "nothing works" social media posts helping anything?

A government shutdown costs are an estimated 500 millions a day.

If we only shave of half of the daily GDP due to a general strike, we are talking about 38 billion.

You misread. Those numbers are not connected. Daily gdp of the United States is roughly 77 billion. Half of that is 38 billion.

Thanks, we'll be okay eventually. We were raised on fables about Revolution against the most powerful military in the world. We don't tolerate tyranny in America. MAGA will never win. When it finally blows, it's gonna blow BIG.

Paranoid has proven to be downright reasonable

They only have to fire a few and the rest will fall in line quickly. This is why retail workers don't have unions.

Everyone is stuck in the consumer/labor loop. One missed check is all it takes to send you to the poverty hole. Even more challenging if you have kids.

I support general strike. But I understand why people aren't ready to do it yet. Until starving is less scary than the alternative, it's going to be hard for them to risk that.

I meant more like to any specific individual. Not the group as a whole. The upper middle class person is just inconvinced. Someone of lesser means may not make it to see a dieing relative or what not.

You should probably check you facts before spewing how dumb a statement is.
https://www.thecurrent.com/tv-networks-historic-ratings-drops-nielsen-big-data-panel-vab-reports

People get thier news from facebook, x, instagram, reddit... TV media is dieing. The big players will survive a while longer. But mainly because old people aren't ready for the internet. And the same old people are gullible.