Which is your preferred messaging app? I just want some insights about these two.

You may share other messaging apps too.

Matrix is just far too convoluted. Signal seems to be the easiest one to use. SimpleX is the best.

@jksalcedo Delta chat is the best

XMPP is the standard messaging protocol. I recommend Conversations for android, but of course any worthwhile protocol has multiple independent frontends.

So, I host a Matrix Stack and I bridge to Signal (and Discord). It's the best of both worlds -- all my messages funnel through one application.

Seeing as you're using Lemmy/PieFed, I'm going to guess you've got a handle on how federation works. I'd suggest Matrix.

Signal.

Signal (but actually Molly)

Matrix for maximum protection

Signal for non-techie family and friends who are not also vendors on the Darknet

I also prefer Molly as client.

What is complicated about Matrix?

Comments are giving single-word answers without explanation…

Cannot answer your question without you giving some context or explaining what you want.
Signal is a service ment to be used wigh particular multiplatform application.
Matrix is communication protocol having chat as main focus, with multiple services and apps supporting it.

Do you want it to be so complicated that no one you know in real life is able to use it for more than two weeks before they make some kind of mistake or change that deletes their entire message history and identity? Matrix

Do you want a slim chance that friends and family might use it, but you have to listen to privacy nutjobs tell you your app is a CIA NSA PsyOp and you might as well cc: potus(at)whitehouse(dot)gov all your messages, it's run by an american non-profit obviously it can't be trusted? Signal

This is how I explained Matrix to my mom: its like an email address, but for chat. You can chat at me, even if we aren't using the same server, like someone can send an email from Gmail to Hotmail.
She got set up and promptly went back to texting me every dang time.

xmpp + omemo. Signal is centralized, matrix leaks tons of metadata to sync between services...

Signal. I use it with frs and family. No need for hosting Matrix for now.

Seconding DeltaChat

That is where signal once shined before they removed the capability of being default sms app

Matrix is so resource hungry compared to XMPP

As an actual usable service with feature forward apps? Signal. But I prefer the relative discretion of matrix. I like more layers between me and the rest of the world in my private communications

@jksalcedo Without a doubt, #DeltaChat: open source, free, and privacy-friendly. Matrix is a good option, but it’s too complicated for ordinary people who aren’t tech-savvy, while Signal relies on Amazon and Google’s servers...

XMPP

I saw someone says that groups are locally stored only, which is definitely a drawback.

What really helps with such decisions is your use model and threat model. Then a nice matrix that compares them all. Haven't come across a good updated comparison in a while. Would be good to see a shared link here.

Signal. The app is miles better. I do use matrix too tho for some communities and for keeping an eye for the development

Signal, all day every day. Nothing else comes close to mainstream accessibility with assurance of security/privacy

Im also dubious about the matrix product, team and their origins in amdocs

Both. Signal for friends and family. Matrix for fedi friends.

I'd go with Matrix. I use it as my main messenger and I've actually set up my own self-hosted instance. It works perfectly for both 1:1 conversations and managing my tabletop RPG groups. Voice chat through Element Call is fantastic – honestly, it's a solid alternative to Discord.

What I really appreciate is the control I get from self-hosting: I have complete autonomy over the server and data for both my personal messaging and community spaces. For RPG campaigns, the room structure and customizable permission system are ideal. The voice quality is reliable enough for long gaming sessions, and everything feels more private and independent compared to relying on Discord.

Delta chat and session (RIP): they dont ask for accounts or ID to chat

Whoever voted this down does not know ball

IRC is the best (jk)

Currently using Signal. If Canada passes Bill C-22 Signal will leave so I'll have to find another messenger app.

SimpleX seems like a good one. Doesn't use Google notifications which is great for degoogled devices. Set it to check every 10 minutes instead of constantly and it's very easy on the battery. Messages come in right away if the app is open, such as when having a conversation with a contact.

Edit: SimpleX is also very easy to use, as simple as Signal. This is important to get non-tech people on-board.

I have constant encryption errors that I can never figure out how to fix it. And I always have issues signing in on a new device. I don't even know why.

I've been using XMPP the past two decades. I use it because I haven't found something that's better.

Both ! Use Matrix with tech savy friends and Signal with your family

Signal requires your phone number, which is not only quite bad for privacy, but also easy to block 2FA for your government if it decides it doesn't like private chats.

Have you checked out Arcane Chat?

delta absolutely needs an account though, it's literally email

Can you elaborate why ? I'm not sure I see a real difference

well what are your criteria? Asking for advice without saying what you need isn't tremendously useful and, as has happened, mostly just results in people recommending whatever they personally use for whatever reasons.

Beeper which runs over Matrix (with bridges) has been pretty good and straightforward.

It's setup like a chat app rather than a slack/discord lookalike so its easier for usual folks to get used to.

As said in the post, I just want some insights. So any type of comment is okay.

Molly has more features and it's developed by
indie devs.

Signal. Requires little technical knowledge, other then knowing about end to end encryption and why its important

I would like to use matrix since if anything, I think its cool. But noone I know would be remotely interested.

Signal is a centralized, US-based service which requires your phone number (thus your real identity, IE name and address), has social networking graphs of everyone you talk to, and must forward that information to the US government when asked, as well as (by law) not tell you that they've been asked to do so. During the Obama era, 60 NSLs were issued for this private information every single day.

People overlook its privacy concerns for the same reason they do with apple: it has a shiny interface and is easy to use, and makes people very attached to it. Behind all that, is a surveillance network that its creators have explicitly said they do not want it to be able to run in a decentralized, private manner.

It has a long history of privacy offenses below (such as refusing to publish its server's source code for years, its reliance on other US tech services (amazon, google), US-government funding, and a US-defense-tank friendly administration) which get ignored or shouted down by many of those above. See the article below.

Why not signal.

Pretty much any alternative is better, as long as its not hosted in a five-eyes country, and especially if it doesn't require phone numbers or real identities like signal does.

I personally have been using SimpleX for friends and real life contacts, and Matrix for larger more anonymous group chats.

Insightful! Thanks.
I agree and I'll give SimpleX a try as others suggested.

Think its relatively new, but theres also chatto

Nope, Is in fdroid?

From purely a user perspective, because I haven’t dug into the tech behind either, I’d probably vote Matrix. Signal is nice but personally I find matrix easier to use for group chats and bigger rooms. I only have 4-5 people on signal and it’s useful for those moments but on Matrix I can find bigger chats to join and jump in and just talk with a handful of people.

Signal is more like WhatsApp, Element/Matrix is aiming to be more like Telegram or Discord.

has social networking graphs of everyone you talk to

Source?

US government funding does not mean it's immediately bad... The internet, thr flu vaccine, closed captioning, and wheather radar were all funded by the US government. A truly secure messaging encryption is beneficial to the United States, and is evem good enough for the president apparently.

Since their messages are truly secure, it wouldn't matter where you store them. Just store them in the cheapest places possible. It being centralized makes it far more usable to the average person, making it much more likely for them to use.

I feel uneasy about Signal being an app centralized in the USA, but it is the only one streamlined enough to be usable by non tech-savvy friends and family. I wonder if it will fall prey to Chat Control in Europe, so the time to explore alternatives will soon be upon us.

So far, I have heard of XMPP, Matrix, Delta chat and SimpleX. Never got friends to switch to XMPP or Matrix for more than one conversation, so I guess we're just f*cked.