I don't like spending this much time arguing against campism but they just keep talking at me.

Can't wait for the tankies to show up and once again try to defend bootlicking.

You say that as if 70% Americans don't already want this. Bootlicking is when one worships people like Jinping, Putin, Trump, etc. instead of wishing terrible things would happen to them. That's the difference between tankies and normal people.

There's this new invention called "planes".

If you think it's a moral imperative, you really would have been here already and done the job.

But no, you'll just watch Hitler from afar and post one liners

Utterly disagree with your 70% contention. If anything its the exact opposite.

Also do you really think Americans are any different than those who live under Putin? Or do you think just like the vast majority of Russians do Americans keep their head down during the day and in private in their heads and on anonymous message boards, they make wishes. Wishes that don't mean anything. That's why they're called wishes.

"BuT wHaT aBoUt AmErIcA?????"

9 day old account with 200+ comments regularly suggesting political violence. I appreciate your effort, but you should just tag them as a troll and save your time.

Anyone acting as if getting rid of Trump does anything is clearly not serious. Vance is Thiels little bitch and would approve company towns hour one. We're lucky we have Trump still because his incompetence is really doing us more favors than we realize. If Trump died early in his term, JD would've had a bunch of competent evil people in power and they would at least know how to properly file court documents. We're lucky Trump likes suck ups and fox new hosts more than people who can string together a sentence. JD would not make the same mistake.

Bootlicking is when you’re unwilling to martyr yourself in a nearly assured failure of an assassination attempt is certainly a take…

Guess I’ll use my Rambo training to 360 no scope kill the prez, ezpz

The guy you’re replying to isn’t the one acting like it’s a simple thing to assassinate the president, nor asking for it.

Shit posting on the internet isn't saving the world from your country's fascism.

Way to completely sidestep my point with a strawman but go off I guess.

Lol. Lmao even.

https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1872/10/authority.htm

30% want it

30% want whatever the winner wants

30% don’t want it

Brother, I suggest you reread the comment thread.

Physican heal thyself

Treating Marx and Engels like prophets and not men with a mix of good and naive ideas is part of the problem. Just because he dismissed anarchism doesn’t automatically make it a dogmatic truth

Righty tighty, lefty loosey

Yeah.

One of my biggest peeves with philosophy is that unlike the sciences, I don't think there is much of a structure to build on and supersede notable figures.

To make a comparison, no one in biology cites Charles Darwin as a contemporary source of truth. He made contributions, and then others did, and then Watson, and Franklin, and Crick, and Sanger, and so on. But no one cites fifty or a hundred year old theories as the basis of an argument.

It’s what they do.

Neither will assassinating Trump though.

Engels weakest work tbh

Like how dare he to call liberation through revolution an authoritarian act? Thats such a lib take, idk how tankies keep linking to it

Ah yes, the critique that's so bad it actually is what made me become interested in anarchism in the first place.

And just like other scientists Marx had really different phases in his work. Some are more of political activism, some are philosophical and some are economic.

It'd make a lot of people very happy for a few weeks.

I can imagine that. I just read it and thought, 'Geez... this is like a mid-tier reddit comment. It's such flimsy strawman nonsense. Not his best work.'

I feel like anarchism is coming back into vogue. I'm not an anarchist myself, but despite scoffing at the concept years ago, I'm finding a lot more value in it as a school of thought than I once did.

Agreed.

I feel like tossing out a thinkers' weaker work is an act of charity.

I wouldn't want anyone to hold up my dumbest takes after I'm dead. So when I say that I think that article is dumb and we should just pretend that Engels didn't write it... I'm saying that as a compliment to Engels.

Alright here's my 2 cents.

There exists an impossibly we'll organized & funded ruling class. Our society broadly is uneducated or misinformed.

How do people intend to reverse course without a very powerful form of authoritarian-leftism?

Do we intent to reform our governments so radically without the use of authoritarian mechanisms?

How do you get the average person on board with a communist society without striping the privileges the ruling class has almost always enjoyed?

I'm in favor of radical reforms. Those reforms would necessitate authoritarian mechanisms geared against the ruling class and their consolidation of wealth & power.

How does a nonauthoritarian communist society handle a billionaire who buys up income-generating property and pays people to run it for the billionaire’s main benefit?

Let’s also assume he pays people to be security guards for this operation.

Property’s not for sale dumbass, it’s a communist society. Property is owned collectively by all the people and the state’s job (yes you need the organization of a state) is to distribute that profit among the people. Any power is acquired via being elected (which is the “doesn’t have to be authoritarian” part so many temporarily embarrassed millionaires ignore) and punishment for self dealing from a position of power is treated as treason

In short: care is taken that an owning class cannot ever develop.

Americans programming will break when they see it working. Why do you think they try so hard to stop it?

30% of Americans are MAGA.

The rest found want as far off this ride and as far left as we can go, and we want it democraticly so those MAGA fucks don’t try to civil war us

If there are billionaires it's not a communist society is it now?

Tenderly, you may have far too much confidence in programing being broken. Simply because physical conditions change, does not mean conservative amygdalas shrink.

There will, by necessity, be some degree of deprogramming.

This is such a weird question.

How does this billionaire exist in this hypothetical communist society? And how do you expect them to buy up a business?

It's these weird pointless thought exercises people keep throwing at me that drive me to make these posts.

If you really want to know what my desired society looks like, it's this solarpunk game my friends and I play: Fully Automated! Solarpunk RPG World Guide

Go read that, find all the stuff you don't like in it, then write Substack article about it and don't send me a link.

I think the problem I'm seeing is that you seem to be equating any use of force with authoritarianism.

You can have a revolution, restore the means of production to the commons, and then just not have a single-party state. You can deliberately distribute power among the working class. Use of force doesn't require unchecked state power.

I'm not pulling the number out of my ass. That is Trump's actual disapproval percentage.

If a socialist/communist society were working, there wouldn't be any billionaires. In fact, if Capitalism were working, there wouldn't be billionaires. There's literally only two systems that have ever been capable of tolerating that kind of inequality. The mercantile system of feudal states, and the neo-mercantile system of Fascism. The very existence of billionaires is proof of dysfunction in every other economic paradigm.

Restore the means of production to the commons. I'll have to see what that means concretely. I'm not familiar with the idea.

In my idea of how the government should be run, one would need to implement an extremely steep taxation structure.

That would adversely effect a minority group within the nation enacting those laws. I feel that this action as a consequence would be authoritarian.

That's my point though. Disapproval on a poll is a big fucking difference from action. That's the difference between loyal opposition and actual opposition. Just because 70% disapprove doesn't mean 70% actually want to do anything much less will.

Edit: Hell 70% won't even vote against it.

Four legs good!

Two legs bad!

Four legs good!

Two legs bad!

Animal farm?

70% want America as far left as we can go? I mean come on. You must know even at your most outrageously optimistic hopeful self that that's nonsense. A lot of us could certainly wish it were true, but you'd have to be as high as a kite to think it is.

I agree with you, I believe. The difference being that the authoritarian nature be geared towards exclusively a group that is VOLUNTARILY JOINED and nothing else. If you want to own that much wealth, you get some fancy new governmental oversight and regulations. Congrats. I don't believe that that has be "authoritarian" to the VAST majority of people. Well over 95%.

Some (most) of the species like to be dommed by a big daddy or mommy of one form or another. They should be free to live like the submissive Lil boogers that they are. We should be free of their pathetic attempt to get the parental figure they lacked in their formative years.

Every commune wont be the same. Let them be wrong.

How does one become communist without forcing the billionaire to give up their wealth? Is it not through the use of authority?

it's incredibly ironic that you are using a phrase meant to ridicule people who reduce communism to black and white moralistic idealism... and repeating it like a mantra (like a sheep, perhaps) as part of a conversation where bringing up that excerpt from that Orwell book makes extremely little sense. You are making a satire of yourself, stop doing it.

Billionaires do exist, currently, already, in our non hypothetical world.

I wrongly assumed the proponent of nonauthoritarian communism had some idea how to bring about their ideal society from our current world.

Didn't Marx warn of an authoritarian takeover of a people's revolution and how that was no different than having a bourgeoisie?

Great! I’m a billionaire and I’m going to start my own fascist party and buy out and flood every means of mass communication with propaganda for my party. I sure am glad you’re going to allow my legitimate political party to flourish.