Hey guys I am new here but I wanted to ask and get an opinion on this as we aren’t very handy ourselves.

My fiancée and I are finishing a lofted apartment area above a garage. We hired a family friend’s husband as our contractor and so far we haven’t made it far into the process.

He has torn down the old deck and put up a new extended one, which looks okay from what I can tell. However there are a few points on the stairs, especially the bottom step, that have splits in the wood. I am concerned that this may lead to loose boards or repairs needed later on.

Based on my one wood shop class in high school, I didn’t think this looked good, but like I said I am not very handy so I want a second opinion. Is this something I should have them fix or is this to be expected?

Update:

They are working to replace the busted stringers. I still don’t know who did that work exactly, but it sounds like it was a worker without our contractors supervision. Still not sure why they put the screws in the way they did, but hopefully it’ll be done right the second time. It also sounds like they will be anchoring the stringers to the ground when this it is done, which some people were also commented about.

To clarify, when I said apartment, I mostly meant in the size/layout. This will still be my personal residence so I will not be renting this to someone else, nor would I consider it based on the workmanship before I brought this issue up.

Thanks to everybody who responded and I might update this again if depending on how the fix turns out.

Has it been painted/cured?

I have similar steps self-built, in way worse shape. After couple of years I had to fix one step with some vinyl glue and a press (sorry wrong word, not native speaker....) and now is solid.

No paint or anything from what I have seen, not sure if he intends to either. It’s just the wood for the framing and composite board for the top of the steps/deck.

What did he say?

If he didn't notice that when he built it, he was fucked up. Either drunk or some sort of drugs.

If he noticed and didn't give a shit, that's just as bad.

But like, there's no way that acceptable. It's not safe now and will quickly get worse.

Are you getting permits and inspections? Is he licensed?

Like, I've done stuff without permits, I get it. But a lot of my extended family was in construction of some form and we knew what we were doing. These pics are exactly why permits are a thing. An inspector would/will make you tear it down anyways.

Mistakes happen, but just from the angle he's trying to screw in, he has no idea what he's doing.

Depending on how much work removing the old one was, maybe pay him something? But under no conditions let him build anything. You're lucky this was obvious.

Quick exit:

There's a lot more wrong just in the pic than the screw...

But that's what I mean, you can't trust anything he's done, it all needs to come out and start over.

@DietCanesSauce The wood is split from the screws. Holes should have been pre-drilled that close to the edge. In the middle of a board it’s not so apt to split. The big chunk that’s broke off might be because of the screw split as well or maybe it was just a bad board. I’d make them fix it. This isn’t normal. Since stairs only really need good compressive, as opposed to shear strength, that wood can probably be epoxied back together, clamped until cured, and reattached. 1/2

I just took a look today and already messaged him about it but he hasn’t responded yet. He is licensed, hasn’t mentioned anything about permits, but my fiancée’s dad is the county building inspector which we have mentioned several times directly to him so he should know what to expect in that regard.

The angle of the screws was one of the things that threw me off the most, didn’t make sense why they were put in that way.

We already paid 60% under the contract requirements for ordering materials/beginning work. I feel like we might need to look at some other options based on what we have seen so far though.

Thanks for taking a look!

There's a lot more wrong just in the pic than the screw...
But that's what I mean, you can't trust anything he's done, it all needs to come out and start over.

Yup, one more in concurrence. Someone who's used an electric screwdriver and watched ~10min of YouTube videos would be able to avoid many mistakes showing here.

@DietCanesSauce Also, if there’s not too many steps you might want to have the tops of the stringers covered with a waterproof membrane. This would require taking all the treads off so maybe not feasible. Water can sit on stairs for long periods and make its way into the wood which will eventually rot. The membrane reduces that penetration. A lot. You only put it on the top horizontal surfaces, basically under the treads. Never on the bottom surfaces.

If that is the only place where it happened I’d remove the screws, glue in the broken bits, sister new wood to both sides of the runner (with long screws that will catch all 3 pieces), drill new pilot holes for those screws that will catch the sistered lumber and screw down into that.

Before that though I’d take a good look everywhere else and see if it’s worth it. You don’t want a shoddy job done on a staircase.

Trust your instinct on that one, that looks like very shoddy work.

Thanks for taking a look! Based on the other replies and yours, sounds like I will be having him fix this. Unfortunate that it happened, but I am glad I noticed it now rather than when my foot went through it.

Also thanks for the tip on the water proofing! I hadn’t thought about that but it makes a lot of sense so I’ll be sure to ask about it when we get these fixed.

Thanks for the reply! I will take a closer look tomorrow morning probably and be sure nothing else looks off. I recall seeing 1 other split that wasn’t nearly as bad, further up the stairs. Everything on the deck itself seemed fine when I took a quick glance but I’ll probably double check it again too.

I appreciate the walkthrough for fixing it, I have never been great with carpentry/wood working but I might end up giving it a shot depending on how he responds.

Edit: spelling

Fire them. That’s not how you screw wood together.

looks like an accident waiting to happen

linseed oil, reapplied every 2 years, can be enough to water proof

@davesdogmaggie@mstdn.social ?

This is extremely jenky and not going to last. Fire them and take the project seriously.

That's not how you build stairs. People are going to get hurt

Would this still require removing the treads to apply or can you apply it underneath somehow?

You probably mean ‘clamp’ instead of press. Your English is very good.

Yes, clamp! Thank you

in my experience, you don't need to disassemble. Apply generously and the oil would be absorbed in a couple of hours. You can put on a 2nd layer to be sure.

Paint protects from the outside and water seeps through its openings. Linseed oil saturates the wood to keep water out (it helps with insects too).

Is that tongue-and-groove shiplap boards for the treads? If so, those are interior boards; they're likely made of MDF and won't last long outdoors in the weather.

Why not just run the screws in from the top of the tread down into the stringer? The angle is what's causing the splitting; the screw is putting pressure perpendicular to the grain, pulling it apart.

Going into the side of the stringer like that, it's a good idea to drill out your screw holes but is looks like that wasn't done.

There's a big ass shim under the leftmost stringer. The rightmost stringer doesn't even look like it's touching the ground. Second from the left is only partially touching the ground and needs a shim. None of the stringers are attached to the ground. I would use joist hangers and tap cons going into the concrete.

The split stringers need to come out and be remade, which means the whole staircase needs to come apart. All of the stringers should touch the ground and be anchored to the ground.

Everything needs to be made of pressure treated, preferably ground contact rated, lumber. At minimum, the stringers should be rated for ground contact and the treads should be pressure treated.

Also, file your permits. If you get caught building unpermitted stairs, you'll be fined and have to tear them down. If they break and injure someone, your homeowners insurance won't cover it because you negligently built an unpermitted structure, which means you're personally on the hook for any judgements levied to grant their relief.

It honestly might be AI?

Like the top pic and the bottom pic don't add up. Either the pictures are of two different attempts or neither are actually real...

I have no idea why OP would bother faking it tho.

But the top pic only has the sideways screw on the left, the bottom pic has it on the middle. Unless OP did it himself and the top pic is before they put in the middle screw?

It's just all around weird

Quick edit:

The wood grain on the middle edge flips...

If it's not AI then it's two attempts complete with different runners.

So are the two pictures from two attempts?

Why are the runners different?

You can have it cheap or fast or good, pick two.

Yeah, I wondered that briefly as well. One reason I didn't bother to elaborate on the problems, if it is an AI image I'm not going to help train it.

How much did you pay for that? Im not experienced in this but what exactly was the purpose of those screws going into the wood from an angle? Why not going from top down?

Looks like he should have done some pre bore here.

No its that outdoor manufactured to look like wood product. It will hold up outside just fine, but not for a step. Its basically a deckboard. You wouldnt use that for a step.

Those stairs look like shit.

Our contractor claimed the boards were exterior composite decking boards that should hold up to weather. They aren’t real wood and are very fake looking, and we decided to go that route to avoid paint/stain.

Everything construction-wise you described were things I noticed but didn’t know enough about which is why I posted here. So thanks for your detailed post!

You are correct, none of the stringers are attached to the ground, just resting on it, or in the case of the right side, just floating. They are resting on concrete they poured, so I am not sure if that helps with the concerns about the lumber treatment or not.

We don’t need permits for residential construction under 4 units in our county so we are okay there, but my fiancées dad is still the county building inspector and will be examining it.

Thanks again for your help!

I work in software and said the same thing when I first saw this lol.

Then why does the bottom picture have one to the right of it?

And why do you delete every comment you make?

Picture two has stringers 1 and 2 and picture 3 is the third stringer. The grain lines up correct per picture 1.

They put the screws in like that to hide the screws. It works when they lay the boards as deck boards, although, they should use the clips that are part of the system, but doesn't work going into the stringer end, which is obvious to you and me, but apparently not to the "handyman" who built this.

Here's how professionals build steps of this sort, with composite deck boards as the treads:

https://youtu.be/uZ3dS5xrZqY?t=458

You shouldn't fire your family friends husband.

That's not going to fall down,it's not ideal that the wood split, but it's not anything that can't be repaired.

You should think about painting or staining the stringers at some point, as pressure treated wood will last much longer after sealing it. I wouldn't go with the linseed oil others suggested. This is outdoors, and you aren't going to want to repaint these at all, but paint or stain will probably last 10 years. Everyone wants less maintenance.

The easiest solution is probably just to add additional screws through the top, and to pre-drill them. Glueing the cracks,and adding butyl deck tape wouldn't be bad either.

Are those stringers made of pressure treated wood? If that isn't pressure treated, then its not rated for ground contact and it will rot.

These stairs aren't built right. See how the one on the right is bolted to a post? The left one should also have this and there should be a "kicker" connecting all four of then. The stringers should both sit in the kicker and against it. The weight of the left three is pulling down on whatever they are hanging from and they will eventually fail.

The last two pictures are from the first and third stringers, both have splitting. Sorry not sure what you mean by runners, I am a total amateur, just learning that all these parts have names lol.

Hey, its not AI, I am just a total amateur and I only grabbed a few pictures. The first and third stringers from the left have splitting occurring, although both have a screw going in diagonally that seems to have caused the splitting.

While I am here, I'll go ahead and say fuck AI, and thanks for being skeptical :)

Honestly I am not sure as to the purpose of the angled screws, I was hoping there would be a reason, but based on the comments I am not sure there is. I kind of thought he needed to pre drill some holes, but I am pretty inexperienced so I didn't want to assume.

We hired him majority of the work so the contract was for more than just the deck, but I believe the amount listed for the deck and stairs was ~7k.

@DietCanesSauce @merde You’d still have to remove the treads. To be clear, stairs have been built for a long, long time without a membrane, which I’m pretty sure is a somewhat new practice. I wouldn’t do it as a retrofit unless it was only a few steps. I did it on mine after my last stringers rotted.

I do recall seeing some black clips under the tread when he only had one board across each step. Based on this and some other comments these boards don't seem to be intended for steps, just for the top of the deck.

Thanks for the reply, I looked up a diagram and I think I get it. Right now they only appear to be attached to the deck and are just resting on the concrete below. I am not sure if he intends to attach it anywhere else.

Thanks I'll take this into account, I think whether we continue with him will depend on his willingness to fix this. I appreciate the recommendations on fixing it though and I will be sure to paint/stain after whatever happens.

Yeah, better double that apartment 's rent just in case.

That's dogshit.

There are clips for doing those plastic planks, but even if there weren't he could have prevented that with a quick pilot hole.

Hide the screws and the penetration won't channel water directly into the wood from above. But otherwise a shit execution.

This stair was not done by someone who knew what he was doing. This is dangerously bad work on a structural entity.

This staircase must be replaced.

It's not unfixable, but if he thinks they are finished then you definitely need someone else to fix them.

I just looked at the pictures again and I'm also realizing that the post on the right looks like it has a gap to the ground and isn't set into the ground. These do not look like safe stairs to walk on from the pictures you've shared.

Sorry I just managed to grab more pictures. I read online that it’ll have a blue/green tint if its pressure treated so I figured these probably are based on the color I see.