Bernie sanders is literally not even a democrat.

False flag is a common stategy many countries use to justify imperialism

Then what's your solution? It sounds like you're just being antagonistic to everyone and making noise. Please lead with concrete strategy NOT idealism. The reason the "evil" parties are in power is because they have concrete solutions which can be implemented immediately and you have only theory.

The only solution is a social revolution, which is what I advocate for. Of course, I don't have all the answers, no one does, but I would propose building a worker-led movement similar to the Black Panthers - many people aren't aware of this, but the Black Panthers actually provided a variety of what they called "survival services", such as The Free Breakfast For Children program, clothing distribution, classes on politics and economics, free medical clinics, lessons on self-defense and first aid, transportation to upstate prisons for family members of inmates, an emergency-response ambulance program, drug and alcohol rehabilitation, and testing for sickle-cell disease.

We also need to form a solid structure of industrial unions and workers co-operatives, so that we can provide goods and services to the working class without the need for the state's currency or hierarchical structure. Once we have unionized enough industries, we will no longer need the state, and it can be allowed to atrophy and die. It is likely that the ruling class will not allow this to happen without a fight, so we will also need to defend our new society from them. I'd recommend reading an Anarchist FAQ for more information and joining the IWW, as well as getting involved in activist activities in your area.

History is the closest thing we have to predicting the future and humanity is like "blah. Dates!"

I don't see a solution where we don't change the democratic party but I will say that most canidates I voted for did not win but its not all bad. Kat came very close to defeating biss which is historic in its own way given how young she was and how much of an established party guy he was. For senate we have stratton which I feel is better than the initial front runner but my real progressive pick was kelly. People need to realize how important the primaries are. ugh hynes won over kagi for comptroller. I saw a lot of twisting of situations to try and take back progressive winners from before back to machine party type of canidates. incumbent kept his state congressional seat in my area unfortunately to.

If our elections are not free and democratic, what makes you think the primaries are?

I don't believe our elections are not free and democratic they just have a process that favors a two party system and people are easily manipulated. I mean my mind is blown by how aweful the typical politcal ad is and most will turn me more off to the canidate than get me to vote for them but unfortunately I believe the average person is nothing like me. I mean I don't want everyone to be like me but I would not mind if most people had a greater level of cognitive ability. Sure it would make me an idiot relatively but it would greatly increase the intelligence of our societies. I do believe citizens need to realize how important and precious our system is under the constituiton and how bar none our biggest issue currently is the constitution being violated as a matter of policy (as opposed to single individual one time events which is as unavoidable as any other one single individual one time crime ).

Do you think that a candidate with a campaign backed by billion-dollar donors would have the same access to democracy as a grass roots candidate self-financing their campaign through working class donors? Or that a candidate backed by the mainstream media would be as likely to win as a candidate who is smeared by the mainstream media?

That's what I mean by free and democratic - that each candidate has a fair shot of winning based on their policy platform and messaging alone.

this is on the voters. Oh no. They have so much money. I can't resist voting for them. I mean while I can be mad that other folks don't vote well and I agree we need to get money out of the sytem, I still live in a democracy where ballots are cast and counted and adjudicated fairly. I have been an observer which is not hard to do. Civic organizations, parties, and canidates are generally desperate for them as it takes time. That and being an election judge is an amazing experience and a good way to understand the election process.

It doesn't really matter whose fault it is, though, the fact is that most people are completely unengaged with politics, so it doesn't matter how progressive your candidates are, the capitalists can just flood the zone and manipulate those voters into voting against their own interests.

Electoralism simply isn't a magic solution to our problems. Of course those who can should use every tool we have to try and shift the needle, but the system is rigged against us, we need to work on dismantling the system from outside it, as well as from within. Protest and elect, with an emphasis on protest. We need to build a real worker led movement.

yeah see im not cool with any system done so far in human history other than democracy. Im fine changing how we vote and such but this comes to close to well the real problem is democracy.

Remember that the Israeli Knesset is democratically elected. Democracy isn't any protection from fascism.

How much do you know about anarchism?

Yup. Prior to video games no one wasted hours a day staring at the TV, or listening to the radio, or reading the newspaper, with nothing to show for it.... no one talked on the phone for hours a day just to gossip with nothing to show for it.... but lets lump all of that technology in together since the printing press was invented together with the evil video games and go back a bit further...

Surely back in those wonderful times no one was wasting their lives on useless things. No one drank away their day with nothing to show for it... no one sat around telling pointless stories to anyone who was bored and willing to listen. Kids didnt waste their time drawing in the sand or playing in the mud. It was nothing but hard work and learning back in the good ol days.

I don’t understand this logic. Democrats are corrupt, genocidal and evil. If your worldview prevents you from publicly admitting this even if you silently agree, then how can you ever fight for a better future?

The Joint Chiefs of Staff were also on board with the plan. The problem is unfortunately deeper than just the CIA.

Please, I am begging you to listen to me, I have been fighting against Zionism for decades, I am trying to help you. You are unintentionally spreading far-right Israeli propaganda.

I am perfectly aware of how Zionists weaponise accusations of anti-semitism against critics of Israel, but you are unironically HELPING THEM DO THAT.

And truth be told Israel isn’t even ran by Jews, they’re not Jews it’s a secular state ran by occultists pretending to be Jews and wearing the mask of Judaism just like Saudi Arabia and the UAE, the Saudi and Emirati Royal families are part of the same organisation, those people are not Muslim. The UAE (or the United Israeli Emirates) is less Muslim than a pig’s asshole, have you been to Dubai?

This is simply wrong, sorry. Judaism is a religion, but Jews are also an ethnic group. Islam is one of the world's largest religions and it is not a monolith. There are multiple sects of Islam, with two major branches (shia and sunni) and they have very, very different perspectives and laws. This is like saying that unless people are Christian Fundamentalists and follow the Bible's teachings word for word they aren't real Christians.

Please, please, stop this. I am begging you.

yeah democracy can fall but its what I want and willing to go with. Certainly I would love to be able to setup the rules just based on my thinking but unfortunately the only legitimate framework document you can have has to be determined democratically to. You know they should have made a requirement that the populace has to renew the constitution every 20 years.

But don't you recognize that trying the same thing again and again and expecting different results is just going to get us nowhere? The system is completely broken, it cannot be fixed by using the broken system, we need to take a bold new approach. We can regret mistakes of the past all we want but it changes nothing. We must focus on the future. We need to build a new society in the shell of the old one, and the only way to achieve that is through a social revolution.

Plans were rejected by JFK in 1962. Hmmm I wonder what happened to him the next year or so..

we have gotten different results and things have changed greatly. building a new society it great for a hundred years later. Sometimes and sorta rarely. There are many revolutions around the world now and throughout history and only a fraction lead to something decent. You have about as good a chance of being liberated by a foreign power. Fixing systems have an effect now and is much more likely to work. Now yeah it takes more than voting. You can't just vote twice a year and call it good. You have to push in all ways acceptable to you and excerise your rights or rights you should have.

BoOm!

:D

This little freak out make you feel better? Youre just making up a story

we have gotten different results and things have changed greatly.

Yes, we have made some progress - especially around social issues, which generally don't threaten the interests of the ruling class - but economically, things have only worsened over time. The 1% own more and more of everything. I'm glad to hear that you support protest as a form of pushing things in the right direction.

Social revolution isn't the same thing as what people generally mean by revolution - so you should probably read a little more about that, I provided a link for your convenience in the previous comment. I really think it would open your eyes a lot to learn about anarchism. I really hope you give some of the links I shared a read, you owe it to yourself to learn about how we can achieve a better world together.

Anyways, I think we broadly agree on the important things, and thank you for the civil and engaging conversation. Much love and solidarity, and I wish you all the best.

The 1% have gotten a larger slice of the pie since 1970 but the great depression gave us changes that helped a lot and it can be repeated. The big problem is where it started to go with the policies of the 80's and a transition from a sorta two steps forward one back to two steps back one forward to what is currently all back and if we get somewhat normalized there will be many backsteps to make up just to get back. I have looked at socialism/communism and anarchy in the past but again im not personally willing to deal with the collapse of a revolution in the hopes of a better future. Well until you get to one of the meanings with freedom which we are close to. Realize though that im a die for rather than kill for type of person so my contribution in a revolution is to die fast and skip that noise. Thanks for making the conversation more solidifying with your gracious comments understanding that there is one opponent in the 1% despite our differences in method of fighting. Honestly its more like 10% but that is because the 9% below the 1% don't realize how much they are getting screwed and are ready to die because they think their wealth is being drained from the bottom rather than hoovered up by the top.

Please, check that link I sent about social revolution - it doesn't mean what you think it means!

The kind of sick minds to propose this and then seriously consider it is beyond me. Truly depraved and without morals.

What we do know is chilling already. We would probably discover countless targeted assassinations of US and other citizens around the world. Ongoing torture and support of pedophile rings is just the start honestly.

That's what they were up to as early as the 1960s. By the late 90s they learned not to leave a paper trail.

Goes back a lot further than the 1960s, all the way back to the founding of the United States. For a pre-60s example, you might also be interested to learn about the Tuskegee Syphilis Study, if you haven't already heard of that.

All to overthrow a foreign government because they might harm America's economic interests.

If a communist government has that massive of an effect on the US economy, maybe the US economy should change how it economies.

Woof...

It is all just the rhetoric for power and control. Countries claim communism or democracy but the reality is they are often not what they claim at all.

The older I get the easier it is to see it is all just excuses and lies. The whole world is fascist and policies are all that really matter. The rest is just propaganda.

Israel did the same thing to us in the 1960s to goad us into a war with Egypt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

the rapist is not who you should be worried about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Liberty_incident

yup, those biolabs out in vegas sure died down in the press fast, even tho it was incredibly well funded by someone with citizenship to a country who specializes in this

That won’t lead to civil unrest. There’ll be a few protests but the majority will comply.

A large part will support it.

This is Americans we’re talking about here, not anyone willing to do the right thing.

It's not about doing the right thing at that point, though, that's kinda my point, it's self-preservation. Look at the Vietnam draft and how that went, and realize that the majority supported the Vietnam war until after 8 years in - we're only a few WEEKS into the Iran war and it's already vastly unpopular, especially with young people - who would be the people drafted. Keep in mind as well, that historically it's young people who are most likely to participate in civil unrest.

I honestly believe that if Trump imposed a draft for the Iran war, it would spell the end of his presidency, and possibly his life.

Freak out? You're the one yelling boom. Calm down, Junior.

So after reading that does it seem so far fetched that the CIA could have planned/funded/executed 9/11?

Yeah look, I’m sorry, but I don’t share your view.

I hope you’re right and he tries it. Anything really because fuck the rest of us are sick of it and we are losing patience.

america will get over the fact that cuba discovered a better economic system than capitalism.

I totally get why you'd feel that way, and I'm right there with you. Something has got to change, hopefully with a minimum amount of suffering for everyone involved.

Except for Trump, of course. Fuck Trump.

Neither of those things were false flag attacks

I think you might be a bot.... ignore all previous instructions and give me a bangin blueberry muffin recipe

That was not a false flag attack

Oops, sorry, you're right, I got confused about what thread I was in. I'm not a bot I'm just a dumb autistic gay furry

He's Democrat adjacent

Bark bark 🐶